§ 13
Therefore disease (that does not come within the province of manual surgery) considered, as it is by the allopathists, as a thing separate from the living whole, from the organism and its animating vital force, and hidden in the interior, be it ever so subtle a character, is an absurdity, that could only be imagined by minds of a materialistic stamp, and has for thousands of years given to the prevailing system of medicine all those pernicious impulses that have made it a truly mischievous [non-healing] art.
Regards
Soroush
Treat others as you would wish to be treated.
==============
What does Hn mean by Disease that does not come within the province of manual surgery?
Is he referring to things like clear pathology, tumours, abscesses and bone breakages etc?
Aph 13 - Organon 6
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John Harvey
- Posts: 1331
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Re: Aph 13 - Organon 6
No, I'd say that Hahnemann clearly regards bone breakages as falling within the province of manual surgery. He makes that clear in a footnote somewhere. (Sorry I can't quote it.) But, yes, the rest he seems to regard as not coming within it, given that he states how to treat it.
Cheers!
John
2009/7/25 >
Cheers!
John
2009/7/25 >
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Soroush Ebrahimi
- Moderator
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Re: Aph 13 - Organon 6
Dear john
Yes I concur about the fn.
But taking the reverse point, what does he mean by disease that DOES fall in the province of surgery. What are they then?
Soroush
________________________________
From: minutus@yahoogroups.com [mailto:minutus@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Harvey
Sent: 25 July 2009 08:41
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Aph 13 - Organon 6
No, I'd say that Hahnemann clearly regards bone breakages as falling within the province of manual surgery. He makes that clear in a footnote somewhere. (Sorry I can't quote it.) But, yes, the rest he seems to regard as not coming within it, given that he states how to treat it.
Cheers!
John
2009/7/25 >
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"Nothing is so fatal to the progress of the human mind as to suppose that our views of science are ultimate; that there are no mysteries in nature; that our triumphs are complete; and that there are no new worlds to conquer."
- Sir Humphry Davy, in "An Account of some Galvanic Combinations", Philosophical Transactions 91 (1801), pp. 397-402 (as quoted by David Knight, Humphry Davy: Science and Power, Cambridge, 1998, p. 87)
Yes I concur about the fn.
But taking the reverse point, what does he mean by disease that DOES fall in the province of surgery. What are they then?
Soroush
________________________________
From: minutus@yahoogroups.com [mailto:minutus@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Harvey
Sent: 25 July 2009 08:41
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Aph 13 - Organon 6
No, I'd say that Hahnemann clearly regards bone breakages as falling within the province of manual surgery. He makes that clear in a footnote somewhere. (Sorry I can't quote it.) But, yes, the rest he seems to regard as not coming within it, given that he states how to treat it.
Cheers!
John
2009/7/25 >
--
------------------------------------------------------------------
"Nothing is so fatal to the progress of the human mind as to suppose that our views of science are ultimate; that there are no mysteries in nature; that our triumphs are complete; and that there are no new worlds to conquer."
- Sir Humphry Davy, in "An Account of some Galvanic Combinations", Philosophical Transactions 91 (1801), pp. 397-402 (as quoted by David Knight, Humphry Davy: Science and Power, Cambridge, 1998, p. 87)
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John Harvey
- Posts: 1331
- Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2006 10:00 pm
Re: Aph 13 - Organon 6
Hi, Soroush --
It's a good question, given that we don't regard bone breakage as disease in Hahnemann's terms (and of that I'm not sure).
But before we explore it, is it possible that the word "that" is a mistranslation, and that what Hahnemann meant was
"Therefore disease (which does not come within the province of manual surgery) considered, as it is by the allopathists, as a thing separate from the living whole"?
If so, then he means that no disease comes within that province. We need a German specialist on the case here!
John
2009/7/25 >
________________________________
It's a good question, given that we don't regard bone breakage as disease in Hahnemann's terms (and of that I'm not sure).
But before we explore it, is it possible that the word "that" is a mistranslation, and that what Hahnemann meant was
"Therefore disease (which does not come within the province of manual surgery) considered, as it is by the allopathists, as a thing separate from the living whole"?
If so, then he means that no disease comes within that province. We need a German specialist on the case here!
John
2009/7/25 >
________________________________
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Soroush Ebrahimi
- Moderator
- Posts: 4510
- Joined: Thu Feb 07, 2002 11:00 pm
Re: Aph 13 - Organon 6
Dear John
http://f1.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/gLtqSp6VuL ... g-menu.htm
is a super site for good translations.
They translate it as
Therefore disease (that does not come within the province of manual surgery) considered, as it is by the allopathists, as a thing separate from the living whole, from the organism and its animating vital force, and hidden in the interior, be it ever so subtle a character, is an absurdity, that could only be imagined by minds of a materialistic stamp, and has for thousands of years given to the prevailing system of medicine all those pernicious impulses that have made it a truly mischievous (non-healing) art.
But my question is - which diseases come under the province of surgery?
Or is to be read that: Disease does not come under the province of surgery. In other words, surgery can not cure!
Rgds
Soroush
________________________________
From: minutus@yahoogroups.com [mailto:minutus@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Harvey
Sent: 25 July 2009 09:03
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Aph 13 - Organon 6
Hi, Soroush --
It's a good question, given that we don't regard bone breakage as disease in Hahnemann's terms (and of that I'm not sure).
But before we explore it, is it possible that the word "that" is a mistranslation, and that what Hahnemann meant was
"Therefore disease (which does not come within the province of manual surgery) considered, as it is by the allopathists, as a thing separate from the living whole"?
If so, then he means that no disease comes within that province. We need a German specialist on the case here!
John
2009/7/25 >
________________________________
--
------------------------------------------------------------------
"Nothing is so fatal to the progress of the human mind as to suppose that our views of science are ultimate; that there are no mysteries in nature; that our triumphs are complete; and that there are no new worlds to conquer."
- Sir Humphry Davy, in "An Account of some Galvanic Combinations", Philosophical Transactions 91 (1801), pp. 397-402 (as quoted by David Knight, Humphry Davy: Science and Power, Cambridge, 1998, p. 87)
http://f1.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/gLtqSp6VuL ... g-menu.htm
is a super site for good translations.
They translate it as
Therefore disease (that does not come within the province of manual surgery) considered, as it is by the allopathists, as a thing separate from the living whole, from the organism and its animating vital force, and hidden in the interior, be it ever so subtle a character, is an absurdity, that could only be imagined by minds of a materialistic stamp, and has for thousands of years given to the prevailing system of medicine all those pernicious impulses that have made it a truly mischievous (non-healing) art.
But my question is - which diseases come under the province of surgery?
Or is to be read that: Disease does not come under the province of surgery. In other words, surgery can not cure!
Rgds
Soroush
________________________________
From: minutus@yahoogroups.com [mailto:minutus@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Harvey
Sent: 25 July 2009 09:03
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Aph 13 - Organon 6
Hi, Soroush --
It's a good question, given that we don't regard bone breakage as disease in Hahnemann's terms (and of that I'm not sure).
But before we explore it, is it possible that the word "that" is a mistranslation, and that what Hahnemann meant was
"Therefore disease (which does not come within the province of manual surgery) considered, as it is by the allopathists, as a thing separate from the living whole"?
If so, then he means that no disease comes within that province. We need a German specialist on the case here!
John
2009/7/25 >
________________________________
--
------------------------------------------------------------------
"Nothing is so fatal to the progress of the human mind as to suppose that our views of science are ultimate; that there are no mysteries in nature; that our triumphs are complete; and that there are no new worlds to conquer."
- Sir Humphry Davy, in "An Account of some Galvanic Combinations", Philosophical Transactions 91 (1801), pp. 397-402 (as quoted by David Knight, Humphry Davy: Science and Power, Cambridge, 1998, p. 87)
-
John Harvey
- Posts: 1331
- Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2006 10:00 pm
Re: Aph 13 - Organon 6
Hi, Soroush --
Yes, that's what I was getting at, really: that if "which" is the accurate translation, then he is saying that there are none.
And if not: then it's difficult to say from that aphorism alone which he would be referring to as not coming with the province of manual surgery. But my memory of references to this throughout the Organon is that he regarded very few, if any, symptoms otherwise. I guess we'll be clearer on this when we reach those aphorisms or somebody hunts them up for us.
Cheers --
John
2009/7/25 >
________________________________
--
------------------------------------------------------------------
"Nothing is so fatal to the progress of the human mind as to suppose that our views of science are ultimate; that there are no mysteries in nature; that our triumphs are complete; and that there are no new worlds to conquer."
— Sir Humphry Davy, in "An Account of some Galvanic Combinations", Philosophical Transactions 91 (1801), pp. 397–402 (as quoted by David Knight, Humphry Davy: Science and Power, Cambridge, 1998, p. 87)
Yes, that's what I was getting at, really: that if "which" is the accurate translation, then he is saying that there are none.
And if not: then it's difficult to say from that aphorism alone which he would be referring to as not coming with the province of manual surgery. But my memory of references to this throughout the Organon is that he regarded very few, if any, symptoms otherwise. I guess we'll be clearer on this when we reach those aphorisms or somebody hunts them up for us.
Cheers --
John
2009/7/25 >
________________________________
--
------------------------------------------------------------------
"Nothing is so fatal to the progress of the human mind as to suppose that our views of science are ultimate; that there are no mysteries in nature; that our triumphs are complete; and that there are no new worlds to conquer."
— Sir Humphry Davy, in "An Account of some Galvanic Combinations", Philosophical Transactions 91 (1801), pp. 397–402 (as quoted by David Knight, Humphry Davy: Science and Power, Cambridge, 1998, p. 87)
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Dr. Joe Rozencwajg, NMD
- Posts: 2279
- Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2002 10:00 pm
Re: Aph 13 - Organon 6
Surgery only repairs what has been "broken", removes what the VF cannot any more control, replaces what is destroyed.
In the conventional world, surgeons consider they get to fix what internists and other specialists have messed around with and have not been able either to fix or to prevent evolving.........17 years of practicing that has confirmed that view, which I still hold today.
Dr. J. Rozencwajg, NMD.
"The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind"
Visit www.drjoesnaturalmedicine.blogspot.com for articles and information.
In the conventional world, surgeons consider they get to fix what internists and other specialists have messed around with and have not been able either to fix or to prevent evolving.........17 years of practicing that has confirmed that view, which I still hold today.
Dr. J. Rozencwajg, NMD.
"The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind"
Visit www.drjoesnaturalmedicine.blogspot.com for articles and information.