First Do Not Harm

[briut1]

Dear group,

I hear a lot about real damages that are inflicted upon patients with
administering daily doses (mostly dry 6-30 C or liquid LM without
changing the potency) especialy to those patient who are very weak.

First I would like any of you who uses these methods to think again
whether you sure that you are not harming your patients.
Don't forget that Hahnemann tried these methods and wrote very strictly
against it in the Organon. (and this is also true about giving the LM
in liquid, if it is not given properly with dynamization).
Please don't forget to: "First Do Not Harm".

Now, A patient, 94 years old, who is very ill today after had been
given daily doses of 6C Conium (which was probably the simillimum) two
month ago, and had to be rushed to the hospital in a critical condition
of rigidity all over the body and dementia, about a week after he had
started taking it.

He is now back in his home and his mental health is good but
unfortunatly he is almost paralyse in his lower limbs which depresses
his spirit very much because he is almost cannot move at all. He is
also much more tired now and sleep most of the day.

Can you tell what do you think would you do now to try and repair the
damage?
How would you antidote a simillimum given daily?

Thank you
Ben.

[John Harvey]

Dear Ben,

Is that a rhetorical question, or is there a patient who might be helped?

Cheers --

John Harvey

[radha rani]

dear group,
Conium Maculatum or the Poison Hemlock was employed in the death of socrates..And it result in ascending paralysis.The legs get paralysed first.
It is a poison and we can not administrate the poison in low potencies unless we have strong vital force.This is a fundamental we always learn in administrating the drugs. we even learned it in administrating Lachesis.We dont even go for lower Potencies in Nosodes. Because lower Potencies aggrevate the situation or even show the medicinal properties. How a particuliar drug acts in different potencies in different vital energies can be understood well with experience and vast readings only. I have observed Arnica works well in 1m potency than in its lower potencies.
The higher doses are always the antidotes for the lower potencies is most fundamental.I have seen many aggrevations and damaging cause with the lower potencies are antidoted with the higher doses.
In the above case, conium maculatum in 1M potency might antidote the drug action. Also coffee is one of the best antidote for conium.
dulcamara,acid nitricum,nitri-spiritus-dulsis, coffea cruda. are the few antiotes for conium maculatum as per boerickes materia medica. The efficacy can be tested with the symptoms developed after conium.
In the above case, a single dose of conium in 1M potency may be given.when the symptoms imrove, frequent coffee intake would make the patient better. Latter on depending upon the symptoms one among the above antidotes can be given without hurry.
thank you.
RadhaRani.
briut1 wrote: Dear group,

I hear a lot about real damages that are inflicted upon patients with
administering daily doses (mostly dry 6-30 C or liquid LM without
changing the potency) especialy to those patient who are very weak.

First I would like any of you who uses these methods to think again
whether you sure that you are not harming your patients.
Don't forget that Hahnemann tried these methods and wrote very strictly
against it in the Organon. (and this is also true about giving the LM
in liquid, if it is not given properly with dynamization).
Please don't forget to: "First Do Not Harm".

Now, A patient, 94 years old, who is very ill today after had been
given daily doses of 6C Conium (which was probably the simillimum) two
month ago, and had to be rushed to the hospital in a critical condition
of rigidity all over the body and dementia, about a week after he had
started taking it.

He is now back in his home and his mental health is good but
unfortunatly he is almost paralyse in his lower limbs which depresses
his spirit very much because he is almost cannot move at all. He is
also much more tired now and sleep most of the day.

Can you tell what do you think would you do now to try and repair the
damage?
How would you antidote a simillimum given daily?

Thank you
Ben.
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[Kathleen Ramsey]

I have never heard of anything like this happening from any potency. It is
probably due to something other then the 6C given. Has anyone else ever
heard of anything like this? Thanks Kathy

_____

From: minutus@yahoogroups.com [mailto:minutus@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
John Harvey
Sent: Wednesday, November 01, 2006 8:37 AM
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Minutus] First Do Not Harm
Dear Ben,

Is that a rhetorical question, or is there a patient who might be helped?

Cheers --

John Harvey
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[John Harvey]

Dear Radha, thank you for your effort to save Ben (or whoever might
act on your advice to help this patient) further thought or
hesitation. Is an understanding of the origin of the new symptoms or
aggravation unnecessary, then, before acting? I'm not sure that the
case is quite so clear-cut, but you may know more about this.

Ben, aphorism 248 of the Organon is worth reading repeatedly until its
full meaning is clear. So is aphorism 249. It seems to me that when
someone familiar with the case knows well enough the relationship
between the patient's present symptoms and his original ones (what are
the present symptoms: aggravations? genuinely new? returning
symptoms?) and the relationship between the new symptoms and those of
Conium, what is occurring will become far clearer.

It may be that the original prescription was a very good one (for one
dose). It may not be. If it is not, then aphorism 249 will be
relevant. By this stage, as you will have perceived, aphorism 250 is
no longer directly relevant in the case.

Feel welcome to obtain and share more detail, and I'm sure that what
is occurring will become somewhat clearer to all of us.

Kind regards,

John Harvey

[Sara Klein Ridgley, Ph.D.]

Yes, I have seen at least one case.

The most memorable was when my own mother got a Œprescription¹ for Lachesis
200C from a Classical Homeopath; This was her exact Similimum and fit her
to a T. She took the single dose before bedtime. In the morning she woke
up all confused: She could not move any of her limbs! It was really scary.
I was already getting along in my studies of Homeopathy and looked up in
Kent¹s Repertory and saw that Belladonna antidotes Lachesis. I called the
Homeopath who did not pick up the phone, rather the answering machine came
on. I told him what was going on and that I was going to give her a dose of
Belladonna 200C. He did not call back and I got nervous as my Mom could not
move. I just gave her the dose and within a couple of minutes she was back
to normal! I gained a healthy respect for Lachesis from that day on....

But as an aside: In spite of antidoting the Lachesis in this manner, she did
have some nice improvements in her symptoms that indicated Lachesis as the
Similimum!

When she went back to the Homeopath (who called me back in the afternoon),
he re-evaluated her case and gave her a single OLFACTION dose of Lachesis
10M. This was about 3 weeks after the above incident. This time, there
were no aggravations, just additional slow improvements.

Sara
"Kathleen Ramsey" wrote:
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[muthu kumar]

It seems to me that when

This seems sound advice.

A proving of the remedy is very much possible in this case. A study of
the existing symptoms should prove this ( and verify this by
consulting any of the older, trustworthy materia medicas).

I have had many instances of such proving following even a single dose
of the indicated remedy. Usually such aggravations are tolerable and
many times also associated with profound relief. In this case it might
be 1) progression of the existing disease or may be 2)proving symptoms.

Radha's suggestion is good. If the remedy indicated is still Conium 1
dose of the higher potency is good. ( This acts as the indicated
remedy as well as the antidote to the previous repetition which caused
a drug disease + natural disease complex ) Or a different antidote
might also work ( based on symptoms - after all, antidotes are
antidotes because of symptom-similarity).

I have not seen many cases of permanent pathological damage due to the
indicated remedy. Of course I have rarely used 6 and lower so would
not know much about it...

[Luise Kunkle]

Hi Kathleen,
One "hears" about it all the time, but only from other homeopaths, who
do not happen to believe in those kinds of methods. Same concerning
combo remedies.

In Germany, for now I guess 150 years, both methods have been used
very widely, and yet over all those years this kind of homeopathy has
spread and prospered and - what is highly significant IMO - has lead
to the general opinion that homeopathy does no harm. Also it has been
that kind of homeopathy that has led to firm establishment of
homeopathy here.

So draw your own conclusions.

Regards

Luise
--
One thought to all who, free of doubt,
So definitely know what's true:
2 and 2 is 22 -
and 2 times 2 is 2:-)
==========> ICQ yinyang 96391801 <==========

[VR VR]

I also don't understand use of constant repetitions of unchanged doses and potencies when Hahnemann spoke so categorically against it in 247, but I do know that many homeopaths who are older, wiser and more experienced than me use these methods. I prefer not to, especially since I knew of someone who died, I think prematurely, several months after starting to take a remedy in this way.
I was recently contacted by someone who felt her baby son had been harmed by constant repetitions of fairly large doses of homeopathic remedies, and was concerned that the damage was irreversible. Difficult to suggest coffee in this case! And hard to know what to say.
In the case you mention, it does seem that if the symptoms are still Conium, to give the remedy but possibly in different potencies and different ways (olfaction, medicinal solution etc.). Alternatively, to give the remedy best suited to the case at this time. Are you absolutely certain that the damage was caused by the repetition of Conium in this case? The patient is elderly, and may have experienced something else during the week of Conium that brought on a worsening in his condition - whether emotional or physical.
Vera
briut1 wrote:
Dear group,

I hear a lot about real damages that are inflicted upon patients with
administering daily doses (mostly dry 6-30 C or liquid LM without
changing the potency) especialy to those patient who are very weak.

First I would like any of you who uses these methods to think again
whether you sure that you are not harming your patients.
Don't forget that Hahnemann tried these methods and wrote very strictly
against it in the Organon. (and this is also true about giving the LM
in liquid, if it is not given properly with dynamization).
Please don't forget to: "First Do Not Harm".

Now, A patient, 94 years old, who is very ill today after had been
given daily doses of 6C Conium (which was probably the simillimum) two
month ago, and had to be rushed to the hospital in a critical condition
of rigidity all over the body and dementia, about a week after he had
started taking it.

He is now back in his home and his mental health is good but
unfortunatly he is almost paralyse in his lower limbs which depresses
his spirit very much because he is almost cannot move at all. He is
also much more tired now and sleep most of the day.

Can you tell what do you think would you do now to try and repair the
damage?
How would you antidote a simillimum given daily?

Thank you
Ben.
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[Christine Wyndham-Thomas]

I'd ike to know how long, or over what period of time it had been given.
Had it been given more than once in a day and for how many days?

Christine