Minutus

It seems to me that helping someone relieve such distressing symptoms as
those described (and which a good friend of mine - a homeopath -
suffered from in the extreme heat last year) with a cream that actually
works within hours and then tackling the problem long term with
something like homeopathy is not an ethical dilemma or preventing
homeopathy from doing its work in its own time. The suggestion was
merely shared from experience and to help the practitioner and patient.
And if that contributes to interesting conversation, I think it is a
valid contribution.

I was invited to join the group and have found its mailings very
interesting and sympathetic to the way I work. I have printed out many
of them and given them to my homeopathic friends who prefer to keep out
of computer energies themselves. However, if you would like to remove
me from the group, I quite understand. If I receive no more mailings, I
will not take the matter personally.

The ideals of the group I see are for "promotion of homeopathy and
educational benefit" for its membership. I feel it is rather sad if the
group does not want to interact with those who share their ideals (and
some of their remedies) but also use other techniques (as indeed some of
the group seem to). It seems very limited and not for "educational
benefit" to be so restricted. Personally, I like to continue to learn
and explore and experience and did not feel my work was outside the
boundaries of the group. For instance, the equipment I recommended for
measuring what happens to the body's organs, meridians, etc. (not a
gadget, as someone called it, but a highly advanced piece of equipment,
taking over ten years to produce and subjected to the highest EU and
British Medical Devices Agency approvals)when treatment is given via
homeopathy or any other form, seems to me to be highly beneficial for
any practitioner and patient to be aware of.

But if you prefer not to send me mailings, that is up to you and I will
understand.

Angela

Dr Angela Blaen, BA, PhD, BRCP (Energy Medicine)
Director
The Assemblage Point Centre Ltd.
The Assemblage Point Association
The Energy Medicine Association
www.drangelablaen.com
www.assemblagepointcentre.com
www.assemblagepointassociation.com
www.energymedicineassociation.com
www.verzamelpunt.com
This electronic message is for its intended recipient only and may
contain sensitive or confidential material. It should not be copied,
distributed or used in any manner without written permission from the
author. If you receive it in error, please delete it and notify me.
Thank you.

At 03:38 PM 08/09/2004 +0100, you wrote:

In trying to help by applying allopathic medicine to STOP symptoms you are
fighting the body in its wisdom.
You may want to help but you will not in the long run.
I encourage you to learn more about homeopathy as it called suppression.
You cannot cure by suppression and you are not helping. The right remedy
could also help within hours.
You are doing no favors by suppressing.

This list is about homeopathy - there are many other lists for a wide range
of 'holistic' things.

It seems very limited and not for "educational

And that is another story. Anyone?

I would encourage you to use this list for what it is here for
Homeopathy
And learn all you can about that.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA, Classical Homeopath
Well Within & Earth Mysteries & Sacred Site Tours (worldwide)
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Hi Angela,

I have been a member of this list since around the time of its
inception.
I have seen people come and go who subscribed with an AGENDA other than
learning about or sharing their learning about the TOPIC, classical
homeopathy.

Hopefully you will have read Sheri's emails?

If you hope to gain "educational benefit" by reading this list, that is
wonderful!
However, since you are not a homeopath, and your posts instantly expose
both this fact and the fact that you have some other agenda, it would be
wonderful if you could consciously choose to post ONLY on topic...
rather than allowing your agenda to lead you otherwise.

Since you claim a great deal of education, you MUST be able to
understand:

You have gained entrance to a vast classroom, filled with several
hundred people from all over the world.
When you entered this huge hall, you saw clearly on the door, a sign
which stated HOMEOPATHIC EDUCATION.
You entered, and were witness to a great deal of conversation on
homeopathy, spanning a range from neophyte seekers of information on
homeopathy to seasoned homeopathic professor/educators. For some reason,
you thought perhaps it would be appropriate for you to post something
about a non-homeopathic skin cream. Since it is NOT appropriate, you
have been so informed, and offered a bit of homeopathic education: such
treatment is generally very strongly COUNTER-INDICATED in homeopathy.

This leaves you with a clear choice to make:

Are you educable?

Or solely agenda driven?

This is an opportunity for you to be honest with yourself, and perhaps
in the bargain, to learn about homeopathy - you claim to work with
homeopaths, yet it is perfectly clear that you haven't yet taken the
time to begin to understand homeopathy from it's own perspective- you
retain a allopathic 'outside looking in' viewpoint.

If you are absolutely committed to your agenda, and unwilling to educate
yourself in homeopathy, let me assure you that ANYTHING ELSE you might
like to acheive here will be seriously impeded by further OFF-TOPIC
postings, which in and of themselves are transgressions against the
list's purpose and your agreement regarding being a member of this list,
and may therefore become reason for your removal.

In conclusion- I hope you will choose to learn here about homeopathy,
and to take heed that a list's TOPICAL focus MUST be maintained, else a
degenerative atmosphere could abide.. those of us who are dedicated
homeopaths and who cherish this list as a rare gem of homeopathic
educational opportuntiy.. will not allow this gem to become tarnished..

regards,

David Hartley www.holistiq.com
San Francisco EastBay (510)776-5914
---------------------

Hi Shannon,
Did all that.
No improvement after two weeks.
Alva

>This list is about homeopathy - there are many other lists for a

AMEN !

David Hartley www.holistiq.com
San Francisco EastBay (510)776-5914
---------------------

From: Sheri Nakken
Date: Mon Aug 9, 2004 1:23 pm
Subject: RE: [Minutus] Need help

At 03:38 PM 08/09/2004 +0100, you wrote:
as
In trying to help by applying allopathic medicine to STOP symptoms you
are fighting the body in its wisdom. You may want to help but you will
not in the long run. I encourage you to learn more about homeopathy as
it called suppression. You cannot cure by suppression and you are not
helping. The right remedy could also help within hours. You are doing no
favors by suppressing.

of

This list is about homeopathy - there are many other lists for a wide
range of 'holistic' things.

It seems very limited and not for "educational
And that is another story. Anyone?

I would encourage you to use this list for what it is here for
Homeopathy And learn all you can about that.

on 8/9/04 3:23 PM, Sheri Nakken at homeopathycures@tesco.net wrote:
Personally I'd find it very interesting (and not off-topic) to hear about
ways that homeopathy interfaces with other methods. If this gives an
objective means of "seeing" what happens when someone takes a remedy, I'd
think that would be of great interest to us, as a community -- or if not,
why not?

Shannon

At 3:38 PM +0100 8/9/04, Angela Blaen wrote:

The whole question is in the definition of "works."
Generally, in homeopathy, external application for external symptoms
are frowned upon because they are often suppressive i.e., they drive
the disease inward-- the surface clears while the inner manifestation
grows stronger.
This was noted by Hahnemann through years of observation, and is a
real cornerstone in homeopathy.
In first aid (burns, scrapes, etc.) an external application might be
acceptable, but in diseases which originate within and manifest on
the surface, external applications are certainly frowned upon.
Canestan is a suppressive cream. It is not, in any sense (except an
allopathic one) curative.

That said, there is often a judgement call needed. Long ago, I was
suffering from a severe skin problem. It was at a point were I was
not getting any sleep and was almost suicidal. The homeopath (who was
a medical doctor) prescribed a short course (three doses) of a
steroid. When I questioned him, he said, "When the house is on fire,
you don't worry about saving the piano." The drugs got me some relief
and needed sleep. The curative remedy was found a day later. It was a
good lesson.
Jeremy Sherr has said that allopathic medicine slows things down and
buys time, while homeopathy speeds things up. Sometime, you have to
buy time.
BMDA approval or not, machines are NOT part of homeopathy. I
personally believe that they are all psychotronic devices and, as
such, are dependent upon the skill of the operator.
I have never seen a machine being able to treat on the deep level
that homeopathy is capable of doing. I have seen them act in a
suppressive manner.
Although the debate about them is still on, and more and more folks
seem drawn to them, they are not part of "classical" or
"Hahnemannian" homeopathy and, as such, are not fodder for this
particular list.

JW

At 9:38 PM -0500 8/9/04, Bob&Shannon wrote:

This issue has been with the homeopathic community since Albert
Abrams found his "reaction" in 1920 or so.
See pages 249-251 in my book, "The Faces of Homeopathy."

The "machines" are divided into two types: Those that make no bones
about being psychotronic, and those that have the gloss of "real
hardware" (but, in my view, are still questionable).

One of the the things Abrams found out very early on is that some
people could hear the percussed reaction on their own, and other
could not, BUT could hear it is HE were present.
ALL the psychotronic machines make use of pendulums or rubbing
plates. They are all fancy dowsing machines.
The others are questionable in that I have never seen two
practitioners get the same readings from it. The Practitioner then is
part of the operation of the machine.
I do believe that there was a test done in Canada (Dana Ullman might
know the details) where a probe *not held by a human* elicited no
response from the machine, while a probe *held by a human* was able
to show a response.
Of course, there are two camps: those who believe that these machines
CAN measure the "immeasurable" and those who think that we are not
there yet.

So the "if not, why not" is not simply answered. Do you believe they
can work or not? What proof have you? What are the long term outcomes?
Roger Morrison and others at the Hahnemann Clinic in CA have treated
many, many people. It is his observation that those treated with
machines were not treated on a deep level, and the treatment was
often suppressive.

I would be interested to see the use of a machine in the hands of
someone with a deep understanding of homeopathy. But... most people
with that level of understanding, eschew the use of machines, while
those who do not understand it as well applaud the use.

It could be why Grimmer WAS successful with his "box"-- his internal
knowlege was immense.

JW

Dear Julian,

Apologies for not explaining about this equipment very clearly. It does
not treat and it does not in any way (unlike anything else I've seen in
this field) have any affect on the patient whatsoever. That is what is
exciting about it. The inventor (with whom I have no financial
involvement, just a shared enthusiasm) first started by very sceptically
investigating all kinds of gadgets, such as the original black box
(because he was a barrister at the time and was involved in the case
brought against it), magnets, dowsing equipment, and then moved into
investigating all kinds of treatments. He realised that some totally
neutral, objective measuring equipment was needed which would not - as
all others have done - depend on the user at all. And he has spent the
past ten years or so producing the equipment. He is scruplously honest
and careful in all his research, and each experiment involves many
people and complex protocols.

Nothing touches the skin of this remarkable device apart from silver or
porous stone soaked in isotonic solution where necessary. And the
results have helped us to realise what happens in the body when various
treatments are applied, various substances inhaled or held in the mouth,
various irritants/allergies exist, and so on. I have learned so much
from this man and his equipment and he would be the first to criticise
(and very scientifically) most of the equipment on the market.

We have all had patients turn up with masses of print outs from totally
useless machines, and showing us some gadgetry they are probably abusing
themselves with - each time it happens it is an awkward moment since we
probably don't know enough to comment accurately. The equipment Ron
Trott has invented is designed to show people that they really don't
need the majority of the "stuff" which is being thrust at the vulnerable
and which often confuses them or, at worst, scares them. I recently saw
a very distressed patient, with three assemblage points, not sleeping,
and moving into depressed schizophrenia, who brought with him a machine
he wears on his head every night and which changes the brain waves -
without something like Ron's equipment I would not be able to explain to
this patient what was really happening to him, with Ron's equipment he
can discover just what happens.

So, Ron's equipment measures without interfering in any way. It can
show what happens with a mobile phone, a television, a computer, a
remedy, a treatment, an acupuncture needle in a particular position, a
particular frequency on a particular organ, a colour, a gem, etc. etc.
And, for me, that is a breakthrough. It certainly isn't yet another
questionable gadget.

Angela

Dr Angela Blaen, BA, PhD, BRCP (Energy Medicine)
Director
The Assemblage Point Centre Ltd.
The Assemblage Point Association
The Energy Medicine Association
www.drangelablaen.com
www.assemblagepointcentre.com
www.assemblagepointassociation.com
www.energymedicineassociation.com
www.verzamelpunt.com
This electronic message is for its intended recipient only and may
contain sensitive or confidential material. It should not be copied,
distributed or used in any manner without written permission from the
author. If you receive it in error, please delete it and notify me.
Thank you.

Dear Julian,

I've only just read this, having sent a reply to your first email on
this subject. I totally agree and I feel that the healer's role in
using all types of healing equipment is a very significant one. It is
something we are currently investigating here.

The great coincidence here is that the black box trial I was talking
about was what started Ron Trott on his road to developing his
equipment. He was a physicist first, who then became a lawyer, defended
in the radionics trial but bought the equipment from the inventor to
investigate it himself (and didn't think much of it!) and returned to
physics intending to be sceptical about such inventions. Along the way
he found that his equipment proved that a few things actually worked,
which he had thought probably wouldn't. How they work is more difficult
to say sometimes.

Angela
Dr Angela Blaen, BA, PhD, BRCP (Energy Medicine)
Director
The Assemblage Point Centre Ltd.
The Assemblage Point Association
The Energy Medicine Association
www.drangelablaen.com
www.assemblagepointcentre.com
www.assemblagepointassociation.com
www.energymedicineassociation.com
www.verzamelpunt.com
This electronic message is for its intended recipient only and may
contain sensitive or confidential material. It should not be copied,
distributed or used in any manner without written permission from the
author. If you receive it in error, please delete it and notify me.
Thank you.