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Re: cell salts bottle

Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2015 5:43 pm
by Roger B
What is fair and what broadens the base of believers in homeopathy are two different things. We in the USA live in an ocean of homeopathic disbelief, and if you charge fees that discourage people from discovering the benefits of homeopathy, you simply add one more person to the disbelieving crowd.

Roger Bird
________________________________

To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
From: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 2015 07:30:43 -0400
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Re: cell salts bottle
Hello Soroush,

Most medical doctors in my area charge around $250.00 for a visit - public copy's are from $10 to $40.00 and you get 5 minutes with the doctor for that. One MD homeopath in an integrated practice told me she was allowed 15 minutes with a patient.

All of us have a finite amount of time in life. We need to keep a roof over our heads and pay living expenses.

I donate a percentage of my time for people who cannot afford my fees.

People look at their co pays and then our fees and decide we are expensive. That is unfair, especially since we homeopaths in effect put ourselves out of business with successful patients.

Maria

On Aug 20, 2015, at 5:52 AM,
finrod@finrod.co.uk [minutus] > wrote:
________________________________

Re: cell salts bottle

Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2015 5:43 pm
by Roger B
"UK homeopaths should charge more."

I can't believe that you said that. I thought that the whole point was selfless service, and the lower the few the more likely people are going to utilize your services.

I suppose some people buy handbags only if they are really expensive. There is certainly that kind of thinking going on.

The UK is also awash with homeopaths, but in the USA most people have no idea what the word means. That is a big difference as to whether one would want to charge more or less.

Does it promote homeopathy? That should be an important question on every homeopath's mind.

Roger Bird
________________________________

To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
From: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 2015 14:40:52 +0100
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Re: cell salts bottle

homeopaths in the US charge more than homepaths in the UK and cost of living is high in the UK
UK homeopaths should charge more.

I lived in both US and UK
Sheri

At 11:23 AM 8/20/2015, you wrote:
Sheri Nakken, former R.N., MA, Hahnemannian Homeopath
http://homeopathycures.wordpress.com/ & http://vaccinationdangers.wordpress.com/
ONLINE/Email classes in Homeopathy; Vaccine Dangers; Childhood Diseases

Re: cell salts bottle

Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2015 5:44 pm
by Roger B
I agree with Irene, again. The consensus of opinion among 99.9% of nuclear physicists is the cold fusion is impossible. What a surprise they are in for!!!

But real science is people trying things, like cell salts. Since it is mostly harmless and cheap, all one has to do is try it to realize that the naysayers are wrong.

Roger Bird
________________________________

To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
From: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 2015 03:07:10 -0700
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Re: cell salts bottle
Seriously?
You mean like when people voted that airplanes would not fly or the earth is flat or some people would make good presidents?

No thanks.
There is plenty of science behind Schuessler's work on cell salts.
And plenty of case experience as well.
Inquiring minds will read it and use it.
Others will scoff, it is their loss, as with the other decisions made by vote.

Namaste,
Irene

Re: cell salts bottle

Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2015 6:16 pm
by Cathy Lemmon
Prolonged discussions such as these, which too often end up in people splitting hairs and arguing rather than promoting wellness is one of the reasons I do not participate here more.
The history behind cell salts is fascinating. Dr. Schuessler, a German homeopath from the late 1800s, studied into the mineral constituents of homeopathic remedies and found a commonality-- this being what we know today as the 12 individual cell salts. The use of these is complimentary to homeopathy, used properly does not negate homeopathic approaches. And countless people have found success in the use of cell salts.
If something works, why argue with it?
Again, a wonderful and very straight-forward and thorough class on cell salts is offered by my friend and colleague, homeopath Cilla Whatcott through her website, www.FamilyHomeopathyCare.com. Go to the "Education" tab and scroll towards the bottom. In the LH column, you will see, in Green, her Cell Salts class and how to sign up for it. The cost is only $50-- I think this is well worth the investment.

A thorough, honest education is important to have before making any judgment call, positive or negative.

In health!

- Cathy Lemmon, BA, CHP
List Owner, Homeopathy-and-SN

(http://groups.yahoo.com)

Co-Founder and Director, Homeoprophylaxis: A Worldwide Choice
http://www.HPWorldwideChoice.com

Saupere Aude! (Dare to know!)

Re: cell salts bottle

Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2015 7:29 pm
by Irene de Villiers
It depends how you use them:-)

Schuessler called them cell salts, not homeopathic remedies and he well studied and developed their use and application as such.
But they ALSO can be used as homeopathic remedies.

SO they are multi-purpose as regards their options for use and that makes them better - more versatile - and better known as to usefulness in health care - than plain homeopathic remedies with only one usage option (assuming such a thing exists).
Or to use them homeopathically according to their provings.

When used as cell salts, they do not suddenly lose their ability to be homeopathic also:-)
Many tools have multiple options for their use, the main thing is to know the wisdom of appropriate use rather than to get hung up on classifications.
Is a hammer no good as a tool because some people use it to comit murder?
Misuse does not disqualify a useful item from belonging to a specific useful category - whether that is a cell salt, a hammer, a vitamin or a high potency remedy. All can be homeopathic in the right circumstances.
Nothing is either homeopathic or not homeopathic.
The usage determines this, not the name.

Namaste,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.Furryboots.info
(Info on Feline health, genetics, nutrition & homeopathy)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

Re: cell salts bottle

Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2015 7:44 pm
by Sheri Nakken
we know all that Cathy - we cover cell salts in our homeopathic education
But it is not homeopathy used according to laws and principles if used a cell salts.

Good grief - you do seem to show up to promote your workshop and Cilla though
Sheri

At 05:16 PM 8/20/2015, you wrote:
Sheri Nakken, former R.N., MA, Hahnemannian Homeopath
http://homeopathycures.wordpress.com/ & http://vaccinationdangers.wordpress.com/
ONLINE/Email classes in Homeopathy; Vaccine Dangers; Childhood Diseases

Re: cell salts bottle

Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2015 9:02 pm
by Irene de Villiers
If the price is so low it bankrupts the homeopath, that also harms the profession:-)

It is indeed difficult to get to a point where homeopathy is better known by the generalpublic in USA and I uderstand your intention that it needs to be cheap and effective to achieve that.

But there is more to it. Homeopathy happens to be able to address what allopathy cannot address - the chronic diseases. However, by their very nature chronic disease have baan around a lon time and take a lot of work to fix. There is no allopathic experiece to compare to, as allopathy has no way to cure chronic disease, and in fact they insist it is illegal to even claim a cure.

So for such intense work requiring many many hours on the part of the homeopath, it is not realistic to charge a pittance fee. The fee needs to at least cover the homeopath's overheads for the hours worked on such a case, MANY long hours that the client does NOT have a way to understand up front. The homeopath working in this area is then between a rock and hard place. They are not even allowed to claim ability in this area, and there is NO general knowledge by the population that chronic diseae can be remedied. This is the side of the coin that you are not seeing (for understandable reasons).
Add in the vicious legal fight of the AMA and AVMA to squash homeopathy, and it is not so easy as just charging a pittance for lots of work.
I do not know what homepaths in USA charge, the only oner I know lives in a 576 sq foot house and drives a 7 yr old car with a $10,000 when new, price tag, and does not own a lear jet or even a spaceship :-)

The issue of getting homeopathy better understood and accepted - as yo want to promote - is more complicated than just charging less. Homeopaths are not worth less than allopaths. Allopaths charge MUCH more than homeopaths in USA. The consumer needs to know and understand that their out of pocket costs are irrelevant in the equation.
What's relevant to compare is the income of the allopath - that is what yo ACTUALLY pay them, whether ou realize it or not - that they get most of it from "insurance" (that you DO pay for whether you realize it or not) is something the consumers conveniently forget about, as it is not from dollars in his hip pocket, but it is the real issue when it comes to who earns how much - or at least who GETS how much. And for what.

My own approach to promoting homeopathy is off the main stream. I have a Cat health discussion group (CATWELL at yahoogroups) ...and some other health groups involving specific diseases that are not understood by the medical profession - - where I promote homeopathy, nutrition, etc, via free advice on those issues which can be handled by email in a discussion format. (mainly first aid ad prophylaxis as opposed to chronic disease.) Catwell has grown to more than a thousand members all of whom now know at least some of what homeopathy can do. (Except maybe a few new members stilil to find that out.) This is an investment of many many hours every week. Because it handles acutes and not the extreme time consuming chronic cases, it is doable that way, and gets more homepahty understanding to more people than I coudl do by some slow chronic case consults, tha are too individual to be applicable in any general way.
I think that you are using one or a few unfortunate bad experiences with chronic disease, to tar all hopmeopaths with the same brush here.
That is not valid.
And then, so many allopaths charge $8000 at least for a chronic disease and end up making it worse.
And nobody files a complaint when that occurs. They just pay. (whether through insurance or otherwise) .
$500 is very little for a chronic disease treatment.

I am sorry it seems not to have been helpful in the case you list.
Do you know the costs of homeopathy and associated training .... and costs of good homeopathy software like Radar by the way? Or do you feel homeopaths should not use good expensive training and pricey computer software to help to handle 5000 plus remedy options with more than 10,000 features each? That is something no allopath needs to do in their profession...and is partly why homeopathy when properly done, is so much more intensive to learn and recover costs of doing, than mere allopathy - I have studied both so I am not blowing hot air here.
It may be "good for American homeoapthy" to have practically no fees for homeopathy in chronic disease - but it is the real world that homeopaths are living in, not the dream world. Miracles are a little harder to achieve than we would like.
OR
Every pancake has two sides, no matter how flat you make it. Please see both.

Namaste,
Irene

--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.Furryboots.info
(Info on Feline health, genetics, nutrition & homeopathy)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

Re: cell salts bottle

Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2015 9:40 pm
by pb000014
Add in the cost of a dermatologist, cardiologist, gastroenterology, psychiatrist, plus associated meds vs one HOMEOPATH, one remedy.

Regards,
Paul
Sent from Samsung Mobile

Re: cell salts bottle

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2015 2:13 am
by Shannon Nelson
Very nice, Soroush!

Yes to "following your gut", and the importance to getting enough of the relevant information; sometimes quite a trick!
As far as cost of homeopathy being high in the US, really that depends on context. My own experience was that the seemingly high cost very quickly began to look like a bargain. IN part because it *worked*, whereas other things had not; but also because the cost of those seemingly expensive visits was quickly dwarfed by the savings in pills, potions, return visits (much less frequent and thereby cheaper than the bodyworkers and other alternative practitioners I had previously depended on solely).
Roger, I hugely sympathize with your frustration. There can be all sorts of possible reasons why the needed remedy may take a long time (and perhaps a change of homeopaths too) to be found: sometimes the needed remedy is an obscure one, or at least not recognized by the homeopath; or maybe the needed information is not given (or at least not heard or understood). Maybe there is a "maintaining cause" that needs to be recognized and eliminated. I suppose there could be other reasons too.

But *usually* at least there is help along the way: remedies that at least offer some relief, and reactions that give the homeopath some guidance. But in some (I think very few) cases that doesn't happen within what seems a reasonable period of time (and money). When I was in that position with my (then toddler) daughter, I was able to persevere -- through four years of "almost useful" chronic remedies, until our homeopath was finally able to realize what she needed, and at that point it all became worthwhile. During that time he also did wonderfully at managing her many and dramatic acutes; and also he had had wonderful success with myself and my husband, so we were very motivated to keep trying, but really I sympathize. I have no good answer, except that in the future she *may* find better success; I hope it will be so.

Shannon
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Re: cell salts bottle

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2015 2:52 am
by Irene de Villiers
A very relevant point I missed, thanks.
..Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.Furryboots.info
(Info on Feline health, genetics, nutrition & homeopathy)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."