Minutus Exchanges

[Soroush Ebrahimi]

Dear Colleagues

I am sad to report that a few colleagues have contacted me over the past few days with a request that they would like to be unsubscribed from Minutus.

Every time, the reason given is the apparent animosity that is coming across!

Isn't that sad judgement for a group of homeopaths who should be HEALTHY enough to able to discuss issues calmly and positively?

I am therefore asking one more time - PLEASE write as if you are writing to the one patient that you definitely want to come back to you.

Please do not be too quick at pressing the SEND button, especially when you are upset or angry. Write and then wait until you are calmer.

Re-read, edit and then send. Check the language and importantly Treat others as you would wish to be treated.

So whatever the provocation, please observe this request of mine and we will be a civil forum once again with growing membership.

Regards

Soroush

Treat others as you would wish to be treated.

[healthinfo6]

Soroush,

How did Hahnemann speak to his patients? To colleagues?

If Hahnemann shrunk like the violet you propose we be, we all would not be here as homeopathy would not exist.

You're perpetuating the relatively recent modern phenomenon that classical homeopathy must have this New Age, cuddly, huggie, warm & fuzzy feel. That patients must be handled with kid gloves or they'll break. This is what happens when you lump classical homeopathy with other alternative holistic camps.

Search the Organon 5th ed. The word "gentle" is used 8 times, "compassion" once and "radical" 18 times!

Why not have 2 Minuti? One rated G for Gentle, the other R for Radical?! Same like movies on DVD. You can get the child friendly or raw uncut versions. Those who want to battle it out, post to Minutus-R, those more timid, Minutus-G. Of course, the timid G's will be sneaking peeks at the R's.

For those so upset that they must unsubscribe, they may be more upset if they find out their "classical" homeopath may not know what they're doing because they are practicing homogenopathy, a blended version of classical and non-classical homeopathy.

Your Ghandi-like methods won't stop the attacks on classical homeopathy, either speak up or be silenced!

Susan

[Shannon Nelson]

Susasn, there is great disagreement on your first point!
It's also possible that if he had been more of a "politician" and able
to swallow his wounded pride (understandably wounded--being run out of
town by the local druggists, for practicing your craft, purely and
completely because you were too effective at doing their job better
than they were--yeah, that would sting!), well, perhaps homeopathy
would now be the *main* medicine of the day, instead of a maligned
sideline. Perhaps he could instead have brought the pharmacies along,
educated the "mainstream" doctors (who after all, mostly really *did*
prefer helping people over hurting them!), and truly established
homeopathy in what *should* be its rightful place.

It would have been a huge and difficult job in any case, as he was in
the beginning "only one," whereas the allopaths were widespread, well
established, and mostly not looking for "self-improvement." But do you
think he made his job *easier* by alienating--and making enemies
of!--the majority of the people in power in the medical field? It's an
interesting theory, but I doubt it...

So you can make the argument that, combativeness, spite, retribution,
blame, and copping a "victim" pose have actually helped homeopathy
survive, but I think a different understanding of our history might
actually be easier to defend, and might be WAY more useful to our
future.

FWIW I'm not going to *try* to defend it here at the moment; just
wanted to state that alternate viewpoint for consideration.

I realize it's less "fun" for some of us than slugging it out, and less
emotionally satisfying that feeling "right", special, the only ones in
possession of the ultimate truth--but is "fun" and "emotional
satisfaction" what we're really after here? Or are we really after
learning, teaching and establishing *homeopathy*--as we keep claiming?

if what we're really after is protecting and advancing *homeopathy*
(whatevertheheck definition one likes to choose), then I do believe
that education (of ourselves and of others) will be a MUCH better
friend to us than will cliquishness and self-righteousness. Learning
to "play well with others" is what we need in order to get
*established*. Being "right" will only get us the "warm fuzzies" of
personal self-justification, but it won't carry us out into the broader
world.
Susan, there is nothing "New Age" about courtesy!
Nor about the concept that listening to people is more conducive to
conversation (including both learning and teaching) than insulting
them.
Wow, that's a great idea. Then those who like blood, can just go for
it and have a fine ol' time, and leave the rest of us out of it.

Until that happens, tho, the pertinent viewpoints about what
constitutes appropriate behavior on the list, are those expressed by
the owner and the moderator (which are, I believe, quite in synch).
They are aiming to have a list that *anyone* can come to, feel
comfortable at, and learn from.

Shannon

[Tanya Marquette]

umm--hahneman was a pretty self-centered and rigid person from
my reading. i don't think he was playing victim. he was pretty
rabid about the medical profession of the time and minced no words
in attacking them.

that being said, i don't think it 'radical' to be rude! that is quite
different
than bluntly saying what you need to say.

tanya

[Shannon Nelson]

Hi Tanya,

Your reading sounds right to me; I didn't mean to say I thought that
Hahnemann was playing victim. And I also wasn't trying to speak out
against bluntness--generally I'm a fan, tho I do think that sometimes
it's productive and sometimes unproductive. IMO it's generally best to
speak to one's audience, rather than to a principle; with some people
bluntness is necessary, or at least is fine; with other people if you
want to actually get your *message* across (as opposed to just making a
point or feeling "right"), then bluntness might better be tempered--but
that's just detail.

What I've been objecting to is not "bluntness," and I do not think
anyone's been unsubbing because of bluntness. But I won't say more
about it right now.

Best,
Shannon

[Joy Lucas]

How wonderfully contradictory then, covering all sides just in case.

I do though hope you are including yourself in this perpetual request for niceties. One thing that has bothered me in these discussions is the hypocrisy - those who complain about the so called 'rude' remarks have not been shy about issuing forth with them themselves. The bluntness might continue, the fight for Hahnemannian homeopathy will continue but if the hypocrisy does then there will be a problem.

As you are a self confessed disappointed person regarding Hahnemannian homeopathy then I am sure you will deal with that apparent contradiction somehow if the heat of the arguments grow.

Wounded pride and Hahnemann, now that's a image to conjure.

Joy

http://www.joylucashomeopathy.com
http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/homeopathystudy/

[Joy Lucas]

Soroush, just as a point of information regarding members and you appear to be keen to have membership grow and why not - how about something be done about all the bouncing members (actually not members anymore, they are defunct email addresses) - you have nearly a 1000 of them and that number reflects in the membership numbers. Surely it would be a better way to judge how a forum is growing by having true members and not a reflection on a large number who are not even getting the posts.

Joy

http://www.joylucashomeopathy.com
http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/homeopathystudy/

[suriya56]

--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, "tamarque@..." wrote:
I have always had the impression that the homeopathic community had too negative a stance on mainstream medicine because along with the Organon they learnt a lot of bad things about allopathy.
I was trained in conventional medicine and have a foot there still and I know it can be practiced with compassion and discretion. I think it is time to drop animosity even if it was built into our learning material . It can be done if we learnt our homeopathy with a loving yet critical eye.
Shannon said
Indeed...I think Soroush is playing a moderator role in the mildest of manner!

I think what Soroush meant to say has nothing to do with being pleasant and in agreement but to use a reasonable amount of restraint and to be civil.
I have pointed this out a great number of times, that if that person you are rude to on list was there in front of you and you could see them would you be able to say things the same impolite way you do on list?
When we write, we bypass some filters that are present when we have face to face interactions which is why we need to be civil even while disagreeing .

regards

Suriya

[Shannon Nelson]

Joy, we could score up the "offenses" on each side, but it wouldn't
serve anything useful.
(Y'know, the "wounded pride and Hahnemann" *is* a difficult image.
I confess it might not be an accurate one. But I stand by my general
statement.)
Best wishes,
Shannon

[Shannon Nelson]

Thanks Luise,

I appreciate the historical perspective (some of which I had known but
forgotten; other parts I did not know). Then it was the plain and
simple disagreement that set his teeth and neck hairs so verbally on
edge? (Sorry for the mangled metaphor!)

I'm also pleased to hear that v.Boenninghausen had better "luck"!
So that took place in Germany, then? (And is there connection to why
Germany has more homeopathy now--and where did the "creative
applications" come in, do you know?)

Shannon