sick kitty

[Irene de Villiers]

Food grade just means it has no pool chemicals added for use in pools.
It still cuts both the parasite and the gut surface to shreds.

Unlike humans, dogs and cats depend on their gut health to absorb a
LOT of nutrients we can just get from fruit and veg, so it is even
more important for them- not to damage the gut walls.
Very.
Most herbs are toxic. One has to check out each one.
Not much. Such generalisations can be very misleading and unsafe.
Check the National animal poison control center lists - the same
things are toxic though more severely for cats.
The difference is small. Dogs have very little more plant detox
capacity than cats.
What makes dogs very ill, will kill cats. Essential oils for example.
Grapes and raisins can kill both.
Nor dogs.
Garlic causes Heinz body anemia in dogs as well.

Leora, You have posted a lot of well meaning but dangerous advice
here for cats (and dogs).
May I please invite you to join Catwell, to learn more? It's clear
you care and mean well. But good information is not so easy to come
by:-)

Namaste,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

[Irene de Villiers]

How do you mean you have not got a case?
You sent a lot to the list already...
Cough like a hairball, sneezing, lassitude, emaciation, sleeping
more, etc...

Namaste,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

[Shannon Nelson]

Thanks Irene,
(sorry about that bacon!!)
I'll get the two remedies and give them, in case.

FWIW tho, he does *seem* to be improving on the herbs--coughing and
sneezing have almost stopped and he seems perkier, and coat even is
looking a bit better. (Tho I know it's still too soon to draw a firm
conclusion.)

Googling, I do find a couple of worm complaints that can cause cough
and/or sneeze. *Since* the herb does seem (so far) to be helping,
perhaps it's one of these...?

Shannon

--------------
http://www.2ndchance.info/cough.htm

Migrating Hook And Roundworm Larva:
Canine and feline hookworms and roundworms can also cause a cough. We
call this a verminous cough. This problem is primarily a concern in
young dogs, kittens and puppies. When a dog or cat accidentally eats a
hookworm or roundworm larva or egg, the larva burrows through pet’s
stomach or intestine into the blood stream. When it reaches the lungs
it is coughed up, re-swallowed and then matures in the pet’s intestine.
If the pet becomes infested with large numbers of larva due to an
unsanitary environment the owners will notice the cough.

...
Lungworms:
The chief signs of lungworm infections in cats and dogs are coughing
and a rise in the number of white blood cells called eosinophiles. I
have never diagnosed a case of lungworms because they are quite rare in
my urban environment. ... Cats obtain these parasites by eating birds
or small rodents that have eaten an infected snail or slug. These worms
are treated with fenbendazole (Panacur) at 25mg/pound body weight daily
for 7-14 days. Most are also given prednisolone to decrease
inflammation and coughing. I have never used fenbendazole in cats and
would not before I checked into its safety.

When the diagnosis of the cause of cough in cats remains unclear, a
test for the Bartonella bacteria called the Western Blot test should be
run. Bartonella was recently recognized a being able to cause a wide
range of diseases in cats including chronic respiratory tract
inflamation. When present, it is treated with azithromycin, doxycycline
or rifampin.

[Shannon Nelson]

Hi Irene,
From what I've read, the DE is not sharp when it's wet--which is why
I'm puzzled at using it that way for parasites. (So perhaps it's a
healing effect of the dietary mineral content that does it? I've cured
peach leaf curl--a fungal disease--by adding granite dust to the soil,
figure that!)

It's commonly (sort of) used as a feed additive for cattle (tougher
than cats, I'll grant you), said to have many benefits; and is said to
be ineffective against fleas etc. if it is wet. So, at least it does
seem to be safe enough as a feed additive--at least I've read numerous
recommendations and never heard any warnings about it...
Shannon

[Shannon Nelson]

Looking up Santoninum I see symptoms relating to convulsions,
twitching, etc., and my guy has nothing like that. Can it also be
successful in a "specific" sort of way?
Shannon

[Irene de Villiers]

I use it preventively for worms - and to remedy an actual case -
roundworm and tapeworm especially.
Remember the case need not have ALL the rubrics of a remedy for the
remedy to be appropriate:-)
This one is kinda like "arnica for a bruise" if you know what I mean
- lots of experience with it as first aid for these worms, and tends
to help at least 80% so worth a try - and I suggested it as WAY
better than a toxin:-)
If the worms start to cause lots of consequential issues then of
course you need to select more carefully. and not by "first aid/
acute" aspects.

That is my thinking....

Namaste,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

[Qwan Yinn Burmese]

Hi Irene,
I thought that DE was safe for use given the links I read about. Can you point me towards some other info about what you are telling me. That is good to know that it is not safe to use.
I am on the raw feline breeders list and there are a great # of links to support the use of a raw food diet over a commercial dry food diet. I know that my cats will try and use the dry kibble for litter, even one such as EVO. They will always eat the raw over the dry any day. I do feed both raw and commercial to my cats. Your point of fresh killed is certainly good though. However, my understanding of the physiology of cats is that they are carnivores and not designed by nature to eat grains. Why do you support a kibble diet with grains in it. Not challenging but I am curious. I have also read the research and listened to the vets that support raw food diets. If you check out RawVet@yahoogroups.com I am sure they would welcome you and could support some of what I am saying with the appropriate lab results to back it up. I may have some of it wrong and am always willing to look at other points of view.
Could you tell me more about the URI remedy you mentioned?
Leora

[Irene de Villiers]

Hi Leora,
It's not links you need.

The internet is full of unsubstantiated opinions referred to by
others and linked to more and more, copied all over and repeated ad
nauseum - that's no way to find truth.
I studied microbiology - all you ned to do is look down a microscope
to see what diatoms look like - then look down the same microscope at
what lung cells and gut cells look like - and look again at the
relatively tough skins of parasites.
Now take that all into account. Add that the reason parasites are
killed by eating diatoms - is that the sharp points of the diatoms
cut the parasite cell walls to shreds.
That's a fact. Researched fact.

Now you tell me - how is a dead diatom skeleton supposed to know what
is parasite and what is lung or gut cell?
It doesn't.
It shreds whatever is there.

Cats have died from breathing diatoms that people spread on carpets
to supposedly kill fleas - they breagthe the diatom "dust"....
I do not have the research stuff I used to have handy on this. But it
really is common sense, once you look down a microscope - it's as
obvious as the nose on my face:-)
Yes well - links again - are no use to anyone. It's the same stuff
going in circles, from an unknown origin. Frustrating to all well
meaning seekers of feline fact.
Every year since at least 1998, there is an international symposium
of feline and canine nutrition, at which scientists from all over the
world, present their findings. These original research papers are
then bound (I nearly said "and gagged") and published (and then
buried by IAMS unless you buy a copy before they run out - hence the
"and gagged" tendency).

These papers are the real reseaqch from which we learn more every
year ablout how canines and felines work internally.
the stuff in "links" starts wih a lot of assumptions - and yet almost
every research paper starts with "We thought that.....
....but it turns out cats are different".....
Those links contain all the "we thought" stuff.
It needs to be rep;aced with all the "but it turns out" stuff.
EVO is perhaps the single worst dry food on the market, so your cats
have taste using it for litter - it's where it belongs:-)
And dogs will eat garlic and cats will eat ethylene glycol - both of
which can kill them.
What they choose to eat is not a good way to tell what's nutritious
or poisonous.
We do not need to do as much guesswork as the current manufacturers
of food are doingl There IS good research we can use, so as to supply
a food that is closer to what's appropriate.
A story from a link again?

Remember why we domesticated cats in the first place?
They were being used to catch the rodents eating the grain:-)
Grain is actually one of the few plant items that cats have learned
to use over the centuries since those days - as they always got some
in the gut of their prey. It's in fact the only kind of plant
material from which cats can extract some nutrients. Not that I
advocate grains as
a major food. But commercial food is not 100% protein and nor is wild
food. Wild food (mouse, insects, etc) is 55 to 65% protein.
So commercial foods need to add something to fill in the rest.
As an example:
ProPac kitten dry food (the best dry food I know of commercially) is
34% animal protein from chicken fish and egg. It has 22% fat from
chicken preserved with Vit E. It has 10% moisture. That leaves 34%
carbohydrate, and it is from the grains which research shows cats get
the most nutrition from, and which do NOT mess with their necessary
acid pH - namely rice and corn.
I'd prefer it to have more protein, less carbohydrate, but as I said
- it's the best I can find so far. It has NO feline toxins and no
plant protein, and that's at least as important for kidney health. I
can find no other food with carbohydrate equal or less than the
protein percentage from animal protein.
(Why do you not?)
Research shows rice and corn (not other grains) are the carbohydrates
from which cats can best derive nutrients, and also that they do NOT
raise the critical low pH of the urinary tract needed fro kidney
health - unlike other carb sources.
What research?
It is not a research site, so I decline.
But I'll read any research you point me to, that contradicts or
enhances what 1998 and later research shows, as presented at canine
and feline research symposia annually.
Maybe - Sorry but I do not have time to re-educate another forum - I
have my own - Catwell.
Nope. They'd have to prove that:-)
I spend my life learning cat research and helping cats live longer
healthier lives - all my life and education is in that line:-)
I challenge them/you to produce ANY such research to contradict what
I know from research on this subject:-)
Anyone can join MY forum at Catwell and look at real research
findings and the healthy results from following them:-)
We have almost a thousand members - been going since about 1998 - and
use verified research, which costs money and effort to obtain - no
"links" to find valid information.

My clients' animals show the healthy results.
The one I like to use - URI 30C - is from 1996 vaccine for cats
including the 4 usual "upper respiratory infection" (URI) organisms.
I like the 1996 one as it seems to hand,e live cases as well as being
preventive - no doubt as it is similar rather than identical to
current day URIs in cats. (I stock it and a few other
homeoprophylaxis items not commonly available.)

Namaste,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."