Hi Shannon
thank you for that and for the reassurance that it is non-toxic. I have never used tincture before and I am normally very cautions as to prevent any worsening of the condition
As for cap I thought there was a typo, as herbs can be made into teas if the substance is used rather than the tincture
Thanks again!
Lucy
Lucy De Pieri PhD, DCH
Serenity Homeopathic Clinic
St Johns Health and Wellness
Professional Center
2226 St Johns Street
Port Moody, BC V3H 2A7
Cell 604 307 5967
Tel 604 931 7017
Crataegus tincture
-
Shannon Nelson
- Posts: 8848
- Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2002 10:00 pm
Re: Crataegus tincture
"Cautious" is good in my book! 
I guess sometimes you can use the tinctures in much smaller amounts
than the bottle calls for--presumably depending on how good a "fit"
(homeopathically speaking) the herb is with the person? But for this
one, probably either way (smaller dose or higher) is okay, whatever it
takes to get the result.
Cheers,
Shannon
I guess sometimes you can use the tinctures in much smaller amounts
than the bottle calls for--presumably depending on how good a "fit"
(homeopathically speaking) the herb is with the person? But for this
one, probably either way (smaller dose or higher) is okay, whatever it
takes to get the result.
Cheers,
Shannon
-
bty17859616
- Posts: 37
- Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2020 3:49 pm
Re: Crataegus tincture
Hi there,
I learned at college about the basic tinctures and their functions; I use herbal tinctures
regularly in my practice, and I find that they work very well; for example I use crataegus
(tops and berries) to support/cleanse the circulatory system - tops support the heart and
berries for peripheral circulation. There is an excellent book - Hoffman's complete herbal,
which gives information on the herbs, their action, and suggested dosage. I used to use
herbal tinctures, now have changed to herbal extracts, as it is simpler to use (drops
instead of teaspoons), and patients prefer it. We have access to good quality herbal
tinctures in the UK, so I prefer the actual tincture to the capsules, as I feel that caps. are
processed (?chemically), whereas the tincture is fresh, and the alcohol can be removed
with boiling water, leaving just the herb.
Best wishes, Grace
--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, ForumGal@... wrote:
I learned at college about the basic tinctures and their functions; I use herbal tinctures
regularly in my practice, and I find that they work very well; for example I use crataegus
(tops and berries) to support/cleanse the circulatory system - tops support the heart and
berries for peripheral circulation. There is an excellent book - Hoffman's complete herbal,
which gives information on the herbs, their action, and suggested dosage. I used to use
herbal tinctures, now have changed to herbal extracts, as it is simpler to use (drops
instead of teaspoons), and patients prefer it. We have access to good quality herbal
tinctures in the UK, so I prefer the actual tincture to the capsules, as I feel that caps. are
processed (?chemically), whereas the tincture is fresh, and the alcohol can be removed
with boiling water, leaving just the herb.
Best wishes, Grace
--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, ForumGal@... wrote:
-
Dr. Joe Rozencwajg, NMD
- Posts: 2279
- Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2002 10:00 pm
Re: Crataegus tincture
Even simpler, you could use the Gemmotherapic Crataegus:
Crataegus is THE cardiac remedy by excellence. As described at the very beginning of this book, the buds combine at the same time the known properties of the flowers (heart rate, blood pressure) and those of the fruit (myocardium), bringing in one single remedy a complete treatment, curative and preventative for the heart as one organ.
One focus of activity is on the repolarisation phase of the heartbeat, normalizing the ST abnormalities. One author (M. Greaves) claims that it might prevent to see ST changes during acute phases of myocardial infarction (?)..
Crataegus is inotrope positive and chronotrope positive. It will increase the contractibility of the myocardium, treating cardiac insufficiency and hence the associated secondary peripheral oedema or pulmonary oedema, as well as the entity known as "senile heart". It will act on the heart of the elderly like Digitalis, but without any of its side effects; it will also potentise the action of Digitalis when associated to it, allowing to diminish the prescribed dose to tolerable levels and even to remove it altogether. Crataegus will also treat arrhythmias, extrasystolies, tachycardias and is used in hyperthyroidism for the cardiac symptoms associated to it (but will remain ineffective if the cause is exterior to the heart and is not treated; this means that although a symptomatic amelioration will be seen, it will stop after a while and the pathology return if the thyroid is not properly treated).
Crataegus regularises blood pressure to normal, whether the problem is hypotension or hypertension (see the remark in the paragraph Precautions).
Crataegus is an antithrombotic and dissolves plaque, hence its use in angina pectoris and in prevention and treatment of myocardial infarction as well as after MI for the repair of the myocardium. The plaque removal is a slow process and any single remedy should never be relied upon solely; without changes in diet, mineral replenishment (and especially Magnesium) and correction of associated dysfunctions like the liver, to use Crataegus only in any form is once again trying to find the elusive curative "silver bullet".
Known as a good CNS sedative, it is used as an anxiolytic, which is always a problem with cardiac patients.
And as a premium, Crataegus is also used in association with other remedies in non-allergic asthma (flavonoids, proanthocyanidins and other antioxidants are probably important in that role).
Combinations frequently used:
* Cornus Sanguinea:
- angina pectoris
- prevention of myocardial infarct
- thrombotic coronaritis
* Viburnum Lantana:
- non allergic asthma
* Alnus Glutinosa:
- bypasses coronary blockages
Precautions.
Some herbalists recommend not using Crataegus in patients suffering from low blood pressure; it has an ACE inhibitor effect and might theoretically potentise pharmacological ACE inhibitors or other hypotensive drugs. Nevertheless, other herbalists, and my own experience, are disagreeing and find Crataegus to be an amphoteric remedy, regulating the blood pressure towards normal. It would be wise to have the patient monitor the blood pressure regularly and adapt the treatment as needed, preferably by changing the conventional drugs, which are loaded with side-effects. There is a very good review of positive interaction between Crataegus and Digoxin in the book Herbs, Nutrients and Drugs Interaction by Mitchell Stargrove. In Sharon Herr's Handbook, I found the following interactions and precautions: it could potentise antihypertensive drugs and the hypotensive action of general anaesthetics; increase the risk of arrhythmia when using depolarizing muscle relaxants (therefore inform the anaesthetist about taking Crataegus AND tell him/her what it can do as most do not know); antagonizes sympathomimetics; and can increase CNS depression and hypotension when used concurrently with anticonvulsivants, antihistamines, antipsychotics, benzodiazepine and tricyclic antidepressants, hence use low doses to start and increase progressively up to therapeutic levels of gemmotherapic while carefully monitoring your patient.
If you are using other herbs concomitantly remember the synergies with Convallaria Majalis, Digitalis, Strophantus, Urginea, Apocynum Cannabinum and other cardiac glycosides, hypotensive synergy with Veratrum and Rauwolfia as well as the vasodilating synergy with vasodilating herbs.
Dr. J. Rozencwajg, NMD.
"The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind".
Visit http://drjoesnaturalmedicine.blogspot.com for some articles and comments.
Crataegus is THE cardiac remedy by excellence. As described at the very beginning of this book, the buds combine at the same time the known properties of the flowers (heart rate, blood pressure) and those of the fruit (myocardium), bringing in one single remedy a complete treatment, curative and preventative for the heart as one organ.
One focus of activity is on the repolarisation phase of the heartbeat, normalizing the ST abnormalities. One author (M. Greaves) claims that it might prevent to see ST changes during acute phases of myocardial infarction (?)..
Crataegus is inotrope positive and chronotrope positive. It will increase the contractibility of the myocardium, treating cardiac insufficiency and hence the associated secondary peripheral oedema or pulmonary oedema, as well as the entity known as "senile heart". It will act on the heart of the elderly like Digitalis, but without any of its side effects; it will also potentise the action of Digitalis when associated to it, allowing to diminish the prescribed dose to tolerable levels and even to remove it altogether. Crataegus will also treat arrhythmias, extrasystolies, tachycardias and is used in hyperthyroidism for the cardiac symptoms associated to it (but will remain ineffective if the cause is exterior to the heart and is not treated; this means that although a symptomatic amelioration will be seen, it will stop after a while and the pathology return if the thyroid is not properly treated).
Crataegus regularises blood pressure to normal, whether the problem is hypotension or hypertension (see the remark in the paragraph Precautions).
Crataegus is an antithrombotic and dissolves plaque, hence its use in angina pectoris and in prevention and treatment of myocardial infarction as well as after MI for the repair of the myocardium. The plaque removal is a slow process and any single remedy should never be relied upon solely; without changes in diet, mineral replenishment (and especially Magnesium) and correction of associated dysfunctions like the liver, to use Crataegus only in any form is once again trying to find the elusive curative "silver bullet".
Known as a good CNS sedative, it is used as an anxiolytic, which is always a problem with cardiac patients.
And as a premium, Crataegus is also used in association with other remedies in non-allergic asthma (flavonoids, proanthocyanidins and other antioxidants are probably important in that role).
Combinations frequently used:
* Cornus Sanguinea:
- angina pectoris
- prevention of myocardial infarct
- thrombotic coronaritis
* Viburnum Lantana:
- non allergic asthma
* Alnus Glutinosa:
- bypasses coronary blockages
Precautions.
Some herbalists recommend not using Crataegus in patients suffering from low blood pressure; it has an ACE inhibitor effect and might theoretically potentise pharmacological ACE inhibitors or other hypotensive drugs. Nevertheless, other herbalists, and my own experience, are disagreeing and find Crataegus to be an amphoteric remedy, regulating the blood pressure towards normal. It would be wise to have the patient monitor the blood pressure regularly and adapt the treatment as needed, preferably by changing the conventional drugs, which are loaded with side-effects. There is a very good review of positive interaction between Crataegus and Digoxin in the book Herbs, Nutrients and Drugs Interaction by Mitchell Stargrove. In Sharon Herr's Handbook, I found the following interactions and precautions: it could potentise antihypertensive drugs and the hypotensive action of general anaesthetics; increase the risk of arrhythmia when using depolarizing muscle relaxants (therefore inform the anaesthetist about taking Crataegus AND tell him/her what it can do as most do not know); antagonizes sympathomimetics; and can increase CNS depression and hypotension when used concurrently with anticonvulsivants, antihistamines, antipsychotics, benzodiazepine and tricyclic antidepressants, hence use low doses to start and increase progressively up to therapeutic levels of gemmotherapic while carefully monitoring your patient.
If you are using other herbs concomitantly remember the synergies with Convallaria Majalis, Digitalis, Strophantus, Urginea, Apocynum Cannabinum and other cardiac glycosides, hypotensive synergy with Veratrum and Rauwolfia as well as the vasodilating synergy with vasodilating herbs.
Dr. J. Rozencwajg, NMD.
"The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind".
Visit http://drjoesnaturalmedicine.blogspot.com for some articles and comments.
-
Jean Doherty
- Posts: 1576
- Joined: Fri Apr 12, 2002 10:00 pm
Re: Crataegus tincture
I have one client using it in a 3x who seems to have responded quite well. Is this valid..? Much less costly and easier??? Jean
Even simpler, you could use the Gemmotherapic Crataegus:
Crataegus is THE cardiac remedy by excellence. As described at the very beginning of this book, the buds combine at the same time the known properties of the flowers (heart rate, blood pressure) and those of the fruit (myocardium), bringing in one single remedy a complete treatment, curative and preventative for the heart as one organ.
One focus of activity is on the repolarisation phase of the heartbeat, normalizing the ST abnormalities. One author (M. Greaves) claims that it might prevent to see ST changes during acute phases of myocardial infarction (?)….
Crataegus is inotrope positive and chronotrope positive. It will increase the contractibility of the myocardium, treating cardiac insufficiency and hence the associated secondary peripheral oedema or pulmonary oedema, as well as the entity known as “senile heart”. It will act on the heart of the elderly like Digitalis, but without any of its side effects; it will also potentise the action of Digitalis when associated to it, allowing to diminish the prescribed dose to tolerable levels and even to remove it altogether. Crataegus will also treat arrhythmias, extrasystolies, tachycardias and is used in hyperthyroidism for the cardiac symptoms associated to it (but will remain ineffective if the cause is exterior to the heart and is not treated; this means that although a symptomatic amelioration will be seen, it will stop after a while and the pathology return if the thyroid is not properly treated).
Crataegus regularises blood pressure to normal, whether the problem is hypotension or hypertension (see the remark in the paragraph Precautions).
Crataegus is an antithrombotic and dissolves plaque, hence its use in angina pectoris and in prevention and treatment of myocardial infarction as well as after MI for the repair of the myocardium. The plaque removal is a slow process and any single remedy should never be relied upon solely; without changes in diet, mineral replenishment (and especially Magnesium) and correction of associated dysfunctions like the liver, to use Crataegus only in any form is once again trying to find the elusive curative “silver bullet”.
Known as a good CNS sedative, it is used as an anxiolytic, which is always a problem with cardiac patients.
And as a premium, Crataegus is also used in association with other remedies in non-allergic asthma (flavonoids, proanthocyanidins and other antioxidants are probably important in that role).
Combinations frequently used:
* Cornus Sanguinea:
- angina pectoris
- prevention of myocardial infarct
- thrombotic coronaritis
* Viburnum Lantana:
- non allergic asthma
* Alnus Glutinosa:
- bypasses coronary blockages
Precautions.
Some herbalists recommend not using Crataegus in patients suffering from low blood pressure; it has an ACE inhibitor effect and might theoretically potentise pharmacological ACE inhibitors or other hypotensive drugs. Nevertheless, other herbalists, and my own experience, are disagreeing and find Crataegus to be an amphoteric remedy, regulating the blood pressure towards normal. It would be wise to have the patient monitor the blood pressure regularly and adapt the treatment as needed, preferably by changing the conventional drugs, which are loaded with side-effects. There is a very good review of positive interaction between Crataegus and Digoxin in the book Herbs, Nutrients and Drugs Interaction by Mitchell Stargrove. In Sharon Herr’s Handbook, I found the following interactions and precautions: it could potentise antihypertensive drugs and the hypotensive action of general anaesthetics; increase the risk of arrhythmia when using depolarizing muscle relaxants (therefore inform the anaesthetist about taking Crataegus AND tell him/her what it can do as most do not know); antagonizes sympathomimetics; and can increase CNS depression and hypotension when used concurrently with anticonvulsivants, antihistamines, antipsychotics, benzodiazepine and tricyclic antidepressants, hence use low doses to start and increase progressively up to therapeutic levels of gemmotherapic while carefully monitoring your patient.
If you are using other herbs concomitantly remember the synergies with Convallaria Majalis, Digitalis, Strophantus, Urginea, Apocynum Cannabinum and other cardiac glycosides, hypotensive synergy with Veratrum and Rauwolfia as well as the vasodilating synergy with vasodilating herbs.
Dr. J. Rozencwajg, NMD.
"The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind".
Visit http://drjoesnaturalmedicine.blogspot.com for some articles and comments.
Even simpler, you could use the Gemmotherapic Crataegus:
Crataegus is THE cardiac remedy by excellence. As described at the very beginning of this book, the buds combine at the same time the known properties of the flowers (heart rate, blood pressure) and those of the fruit (myocardium), bringing in one single remedy a complete treatment, curative and preventative for the heart as one organ.
One focus of activity is on the repolarisation phase of the heartbeat, normalizing the ST abnormalities. One author (M. Greaves) claims that it might prevent to see ST changes during acute phases of myocardial infarction (?)….
Crataegus is inotrope positive and chronotrope positive. It will increase the contractibility of the myocardium, treating cardiac insufficiency and hence the associated secondary peripheral oedema or pulmonary oedema, as well as the entity known as “senile heart”. It will act on the heart of the elderly like Digitalis, but without any of its side effects; it will also potentise the action of Digitalis when associated to it, allowing to diminish the prescribed dose to tolerable levels and even to remove it altogether. Crataegus will also treat arrhythmias, extrasystolies, tachycardias and is used in hyperthyroidism for the cardiac symptoms associated to it (but will remain ineffective if the cause is exterior to the heart and is not treated; this means that although a symptomatic amelioration will be seen, it will stop after a while and the pathology return if the thyroid is not properly treated).
Crataegus regularises blood pressure to normal, whether the problem is hypotension or hypertension (see the remark in the paragraph Precautions).
Crataegus is an antithrombotic and dissolves plaque, hence its use in angina pectoris and in prevention and treatment of myocardial infarction as well as after MI for the repair of the myocardium. The plaque removal is a slow process and any single remedy should never be relied upon solely; without changes in diet, mineral replenishment (and especially Magnesium) and correction of associated dysfunctions like the liver, to use Crataegus only in any form is once again trying to find the elusive curative “silver bullet”.
Known as a good CNS sedative, it is used as an anxiolytic, which is always a problem with cardiac patients.
And as a premium, Crataegus is also used in association with other remedies in non-allergic asthma (flavonoids, proanthocyanidins and other antioxidants are probably important in that role).
Combinations frequently used:
* Cornus Sanguinea:
- angina pectoris
- prevention of myocardial infarct
- thrombotic coronaritis
* Viburnum Lantana:
- non allergic asthma
* Alnus Glutinosa:
- bypasses coronary blockages
Precautions.
Some herbalists recommend not using Crataegus in patients suffering from low blood pressure; it has an ACE inhibitor effect and might theoretically potentise pharmacological ACE inhibitors or other hypotensive drugs. Nevertheless, other herbalists, and my own experience, are disagreeing and find Crataegus to be an amphoteric remedy, regulating the blood pressure towards normal. It would be wise to have the patient monitor the blood pressure regularly and adapt the treatment as needed, preferably by changing the conventional drugs, which are loaded with side-effects. There is a very good review of positive interaction between Crataegus and Digoxin in the book Herbs, Nutrients and Drugs Interaction by Mitchell Stargrove. In Sharon Herr’s Handbook, I found the following interactions and precautions: it could potentise antihypertensive drugs and the hypotensive action of general anaesthetics; increase the risk of arrhythmia when using depolarizing muscle relaxants (therefore inform the anaesthetist about taking Crataegus AND tell him/her what it can do as most do not know); antagonizes sympathomimetics; and can increase CNS depression and hypotension when used concurrently with anticonvulsivants, antihistamines, antipsychotics, benzodiazepine and tricyclic antidepressants, hence use low doses to start and increase progressively up to therapeutic levels of gemmotherapic while carefully monitoring your patient.
If you are using other herbs concomitantly remember the synergies with Convallaria Majalis, Digitalis, Strophantus, Urginea, Apocynum Cannabinum and other cardiac glycosides, hypotensive synergy with Veratrum and Rauwolfia as well as the vasodilating synergy with vasodilating herbs.
Dr. J. Rozencwajg, NMD.
"The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind".
Visit http://drjoesnaturalmedicine.blogspot.com for some articles and comments.
-
Shannon Nelson
- Posts: 8848
- Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2002 10:00 pm
Re: Crataegus tincture
Wonderful to know about!
What of this might apply--and are there rubrics or whatever that might
apply--to a patient whose MRI shows what looks like a white coating
around the inner sinus of the brain; the doc described it as something
like scar tissue from "hundreds of tiny strokes", which I *assume*
means that the capillaries are becoming clogged. (Why... She is way
"over-acid" according to urine testing; she has recently noticed--but
no doubt *not* recently developed--high blood sugar; she's got
long-time chronic "stress", with many of the goodies that implies
(inflammatory this-and-that--sorry, don't have details at hand.) Her
feet had gotten sort of mottled purple, and I assume that's due to the
same process??? (Haven't been able to turn any of this into any useful
remedy, tho.
( Natto is helping her feet, so hopefully helping
her brain too.)
I know there's no "case" here; I'm just fishing to background
information! And wondering whether crataegus might apply to that
situation.
Thanks!
Shannon
What of this might apply--and are there rubrics or whatever that might
apply--to a patient whose MRI shows what looks like a white coating
around the inner sinus of the brain; the doc described it as something
like scar tissue from "hundreds of tiny strokes", which I *assume*
means that the capillaries are becoming clogged. (Why... She is way
"over-acid" according to urine testing; she has recently noticed--but
no doubt *not* recently developed--high blood sugar; she's got
long-time chronic "stress", with many of the goodies that implies
(inflammatory this-and-that--sorry, don't have details at hand.) Her
feet had gotten sort of mottled purple, and I assume that's due to the
same process??? (Haven't been able to turn any of this into any useful
remedy, tho.
( Natto is helping her feet, so hopefully helping her brain too.)
I know there's no "case" here; I'm just fishing to background
information! And wondering whether crataegus might apply to that
situation.
Thanks!
Shannon
-
Dr. Joe Rozencwajg, NMD
- Posts: 2279
- Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2002 10:00 pm
Re: Crataegus tincture
Theoretically they are either 1X or concentrate, but if 3X works, why not.
Easy to use, not really, as they are powerful so it is easy to overdose, those are HERBAL remedies, but once you have the proper dose under good supervision, it becomes a breeze.
Cheaper in the long run, the bottle is expensive (NZ$60.00) but it lasts at least 3 months....and generally you associate a few remedies together.
Mandatory homeopathic content the gemmotherapic remedies have almost the same indications as found in the MM of other disciplines and homeopathy too, at the physical level....
Dr. J. Rozencwajg, NMD.
"The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind".
Visit http://drjoesnaturalmedicine.blogspot.com for some articles and comments.
Easy to use, not really, as they are powerful so it is easy to overdose, those are HERBAL remedies, but once you have the proper dose under good supervision, it becomes a breeze.
Cheaper in the long run, the bottle is expensive (NZ$60.00) but it lasts at least 3 months....and generally you associate a few remedies together.
Mandatory homeopathic content
the gemmotherapic remedies have almost the same indications as found in the MM of other disciplines and homeopathy too, at the physical level....Dr. J. Rozencwajg, NMD.
"The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind".
Visit http://drjoesnaturalmedicine.blogspot.com for some articles and comments.
-
Jean Doherty
- Posts: 1576
- Joined: Fri Apr 12, 2002 10:00 pm
Re: Crataegus tincture
Should have said great information particularly effects with other drugs. Useful to know, Thanks Jean
Even simpler, you could use the Gemmotherapic Crataegus:
Crataegus is THE cardiac remedy by excellence. As described at the very beginning of this book, the buds combine at the same time the known properties of the flowers (heart rate, blood pressure) and those of the fruit (myocardium), bringing in one single remedy a complete treatment, curative and preventative for the heart as one organ.
.
Even simpler, you could use the Gemmotherapic Crataegus:
Crataegus is THE cardiac remedy by excellence. As described at the very beginning of this book, the buds combine at the same time the known properties of the flowers (heart rate, blood pressure) and those of the fruit (myocardium), bringing in one single remedy a complete treatment, curative and preventative for the heart as one organ.
.
-
Irene de Villiers
- Posts: 3237
- Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:00 pm
Re: Crataegus tincture
I am not so sure about the misuse of it. It is indeed possible to use too
much and it is wise to introduce it gradually as I described. It is a
powerful herb for the heart and you do not want to overdo it.
So I would start with less (as I did 2 caps meaning capsules) and
gradually work up (as I did to MY dose ideal of 8 caps a day and not all
at once either) measuring blood pressure daily to see what it is doing,
and allowing a few days at each dose for the herb to work.
So I would NOT say it is completely innocuous - it is material dose we are
using here, not potentized homeopathy.
Also it is not enough by itself - I used homeopathy as well. (Simillimum
not constitutional)
BUT - How about using it in the gemmotherapy method?
(I did not know about it when I used the herbal version)
Crataegus is one of the gemmotherapic remedies and they are a lot more
powerful than any herbal remedy - (think plant stem cell power). Dr
Rozencwajg has a wonderful book on them - "Dynamic Gemmotherapy" available
at lulu.com.
It explains what they can do and how to use them etc.
Namaste,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."
-
Shannon Nelson
- Posts: 8848
- Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2002 10:00 pm
Re: Crataegus tincture
Is overdosing a concern even with a gemmotherapy remedy of an herb
which is apparently nontoxic? (E.g. crataegus?)
Shannon
which is apparently nontoxic? (E.g. crataegus?)
Shannon