what is behind the symptoms

[Sheri Nakken]

At 05:06 PM 10/18/2007 +0100, you wrote:

Sorry, don't agree
Just because a doctor doesn't find anything, doesn't mean there isn't anything
And we can risk treating even though we don't know everything - we never
know everything
Yes, he uses the concepts as another tool helpful to find the remedy
Sheri
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[muthu kumar]

Old chinese healers did not know

May be first we should find how knowledge of modern medicine can help
in homeopathy- and how to use it to further our understanding of our
medicines and their impact on the psycho somatic units - patients.

There is no reason why some one would not learn from modern medicine
but would be willing to learn from older systems of medicine where
most of the wisdom contained within is couthed in mysticism and is
open to interpretation.

I am not knocking them down- but I do not like people knocking down
modern research either.

Any knowledge that we have should allow us to expand based on that...
If I take an Indian herb - I can easily convert it to a homeopathic
medicine- I can create a proving or sometimes administer even based on
herbal usage and make a note of symptoms produced and symptoms
cured... how would I introduce the same Indian herb into acupuncture
system? How would I fit it into a five element theory?

Each medicine has a set of rules and its own realm for implementing
these rules. When we borrow from another system it should be easy for
us to use the same without mangling our fundamental philosophy. I can
defend giving even Steroids in potencies to someone with immune
deficiency even if there is no potency proving since we KNOW steroid
CAUSES immune deficiency. What it can cause it can cure- How would I
defend homeopathically giving Ant.crud to someone because the Lung
meridian is deficient. I am not saying it cannot be done - or it is
wrong. But it asks me to be an expert in extra things...and it is by
faith and a far fetched inference that I would be able to do this...

We can very easily practice with a background in allopathy since the
founder onwards most of the greats in homeopathy had an allopathic MD.
Making use of our existing works fully would require a good working
knowledge of allopathy. Take a look at special pathology by Raue, Go
thru Knerr's repertory - one of the best clinical repertories we have
- or Lilienthal-

Most of the new fangled approaches to prescribing came about not just
because they offer better results - but because the prescribing
population changed and their understanding and making use of existing
works.

[Michael]

if the doctors say that they cannot find anything, at
least it means that a patient is not terminally ill
and has no serious organ pathology, and we cannot risk
anything if we treat him/her without knowing all the
details of the patient's condition.
many things can be understood from the point of view
of Chinese medicine. Old chinese healers did not know
anatomy and physiology in such minute details as it is
known now, but they had their own theory which
explained how organs work and what symptoms mean.
Luc de Schepper is writing a book about Homeopathy and
Chinese medicine, I guess he found how knowledge of
Chinese medicine (its theory) can help in homeopathy.

Michael

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[Michael]

So it means that we risk in every case. if a doctor
makes a mistake, he will not suffer usually. but if a
homeopath makes a mistake, it will be a problem?

Michael

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[Shannon Nelson]

The only circumstances I can think of where it might, would be either
if the condition is extremely critical--"something needs to work
NOW"--or the patient extremely oversensitive; or if the posology is
wildly mismatched to the patient--way too high, or way too much, or
etc.

Generally, tho, you'd much rather have a wrong sugar pill than a wrong
drug or mistaken surgery!
Shannon

[Michael]

If we speak about mistaken surgeries, in one
provincial hospital a patient was prepared for
operation to cut off his non-functioning kidney.
Unfortunately the kidney was marked incorrectly or not
marked at all (I do not remember the details), and the
doctor cut off the healthy kidney. So the patient
remained with one non-functioning kidney.

Michael

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[Irene de Villiers]

[For some reason I did not get this original post but saw it in
someone's answer.]
I'd like to make some comments:
Oh but that is often not true!
Many rare diseases cause death before diagnosis. My grandfather was a
case in point - he had a kidney defect that spilled his potassium. He
died of a heart attack, undiagnosed, due to low potassium, despite all
his complaints and symptoms which the doctors did not understand.
Another example - In MEN-1 syndrome (multiple endocrine neoplasia type
one), this is very often NOT diagnosed before death or before it is too
late - doctors know something is wrong - they can not find what is wrong
- and life expectancy (2 yrs) can run out before the diagnosis is made!
My own diagnosis with symptoms that started in 1998 - at least a
partial diagnosis (it was less than half what was wrong and not the
cause either, just one of the hormones involved) took 13 doctors and 4
years, with life expectancy of 5 years max. (I'm here thanks to homeopathy.)
On the contrary - there can be VERY serious organ pathology without it
being seen. Doctors only see what they test for - and they only test for
things if they suspect them in advance. It's a pretty lousy way to get a
diagnosis in ANY rare condition. There are many many rare conditions and
doctors are NOT looking for them, despite their being serious!
In that case you can never treat anybody - as you will NEVER know "all
the details".

The homeopath's job is to do no harm - and doing nothing when we can
help is doing a LOT of harm!
If my own homeopath had such a fraidy-cat frame of mind I'd have long
since been "feeding the worms".

I follow the maxim in my signature lines:-)
Namaste,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

[Shannon Nelson]

I thought he was saying, "There's nothing to lose by trying"??
Since by his reasoning "all tests normal" at least could be reasonably
expected to mean that the patient is not on the verge of dropping
dead...
? Shannon

[Luise Kunkle]

Hi Irene,
Indeed!!

Looking back, I had hypothyreosis even during pregnancy, which could
have severly harmed the baby. I was lucky - it seems that all the
hormone available was given to the foetus, so he escaped unharmed.

The obstretician did not take my complaints serious - always told me
I was in fine shape and "to forget my idea that pregnancy meant being
ill!!!"

It was 25 years later that it was diagnosed And if I had not stamped
my foot plus studied on my own it probably would have been
mis-diagnosed even then.

I think the most valuable advice I myself could give any therapist is
to take your patient serious. Do NOT put complaints down to
psychological factors, as my obstretician did.

Another instance.

A friend of mine had digestive problems. The doctors put it down to
"problems with her partner" and convinced her of it, so that in spite
of my urgings to have more diagnostics done she did not do so.

They were taught better when her colon cancer broke up into the
peritoneal cavity. She was saved then by an emergency operation - but
the cancer was by then so advanced that she died of it 3 years later.

Regards

Luise
--
One thought to all who, free of doubt,
So definitely know what's true:
2 and 2 is 22 -
and 2 times 2 is 2:-)
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[Irene de Villiers]

Robert & Shannon Nelson wrote:

Oh! If so, sorry I did not get that intention:-(
The real problem is that "All tests normal" only covers what was tested.
The problem often is (as in my case) that the test which would find the
problem, was not done. There are millions of tests - and no doctor
orders them all - the patient would be out of time before they all could
be done anyway.
They only order a "few" tests (however many it might seem!) according to
the best guesses from the symptoms reported.

So - The patient can indeed be on the verge of dropping dead, and have
"all tests normal"! All the ones that were used:-)

Namaste,
IRene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."