New to Group: the education of a homeopath--

[kimberlyanderson7654]

Hello You-All! (sorry, Texas speak )

I have a profound interest in homeopathy, as well as Asian
Medicine. In fact, I am preparing to move to cities to attend
schools that teach the above, including naturopathic medicine.
(Seattle/Portland).

Although one can attain a dual ND w/MS in Oriental Medicine
(acupuncture), with the ND portion teaching some homeopathy, I am
most interested in 'mastering' the type of 'medicine' that will have
the greatest impact on my future patients---is this homeopathy?

It seems that to have good-great success with homeopathy that this
success lies strongly with the
strengths/skills/experiences/knowledge of the homeopath--that the
limitation(s) in homeopathy lies more within the practitioner than
with the science. Finding the correct remedy (simillimum) takes
tremendous 'effort' and skill....While with say, acupuncture, a
practitioner can have a good effect without being exact or correct
in his/her diagnosis or treatment.

I'm especially interested in treating patients that 'suffer' from
fatigue, arthritis (osteo/rheuma/lupus/fibro), and pain syndromes.

Any thoughts or advice would be greatly welcomed. Thank you so very
much for any help.

[prestonfoell]

Hi--

Great questions! I'm not a practicing homeopath (student); many
others in this group could perhaps help you much more than I can.

But, it may be helpful although challenging to find people who have
been treated either homeopathically (classical) or by TCMacupuncture
or both and find out what their results were. Possibly find some
patient newsgroups online of the different patient populations you
are most interested in.

Both systems work, but I do not know which system would benefit the
patient most. Often homeopaths work with patients who have already
been treated by acupuncturists and naturopaths. I'm really not sure
if this means that homeopaths have greater success or rather that
certain patients are trying another option in their search for help.

Good luck in your search--
--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, "kimberlyanderson7654"
wrote:
have
very

[Jean Doherty]

Depends on which you are most attracted to. I started of with
acupuncture. Found many things easy but complex disease needs great
understanding of deep principles, pulse pressures, connecting
points., the Chinese theories of heat and damp, the 5 elements,etc.
Energy certainly moves around body and can be depleted as well as
reinforced. Homeopathy is addicting after first few successes. One
is hooked before one realizes how difficult it is. The hunt for the
remedy,trying to find the right rubrics ,to understand what is going
on is exciting. I feel different people hang their healing talents
on different modalities and one trusts the universe to find the way
that suits. Naive?/? Best wishes Jean
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Shannon Nelson]

Not too many people are significantly experienced in *both* acupuncture
and homeopathy (tho I know there are a few), and without a good, solid
experience of both, it's really hard for anyone to draw a meaningful
experience, I think. Naturapathy school, tho, would give you some
experience and background in both, so would be a good starting point
for deciding which you feel most drawn to. Be aware, tho, that
naturalpathy school will give you *only* a beginning in either of those
modalities--both are very broad, rich methods that each require years
of practice to really get good at. I've met a couple of naturapaths
who seemed not to be aware of that, and aren't aware of their
limitations in practicing homeopathy (so I would guess that the same
situation might happen with acupuncture). I think the advantage to
naturapathic training is that it gives a great framework, and some very
useful background and methods--just realize that it's not
comprehensive with regard to either homeopathy or acupuncture!

Good luck--it should be a wonderful journey, whichever route you go!
Shannon
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Bill Giman]

My first teacher was Luc DeSchepper, MD., PhD in Oriental Medicine, and
lastly a Homeopath.

He stated that of all the healing modalities he practiced, the best is
Homeopathy, the worst is Allopathic Medicine.

Regards,
Bill Giman

[Dr. Joe Rozencwajg, NMD]

Well I think I am, so here is my take on it.........
With acupuncture/TCM, the aim is to restore proper energetic balance; in
order to find the imbalance you use diagnostic instruments like tongue and
pulse that are objective, on top of your history. Once the balance is
restored and tongue and pulse are back to normal the treatment is deemed
finished and cure achieved.
But.............
The examination only shows the end result of a process that sometimes has
taken years if not decades to establish itself. You restore balance today,
if you are a good TCM practitioner you use the 5 Elelments, Mother-Son
relations, all the pathogenetic processes are corrected, but not the origin,
the root of the problem.
For example you do not address abuse in childhood, you address its effects
as they appear now.
If the patient's constitution is strong enough, that treatment might trigger
a healing process and end the situation once and for all; if OTOH as is
usual in long, chronic cases, the constitution has been weakened and the
root of the problem is not addressed, symptoms will recur or new ones will
appear.
I found out that only through homeopathy I could help the patient solve the
deep seated issues and not have relapses, then fine-touching the multiple
one-sided pathologies that have been created over the years.
An example: last week a patient comes in to try to replace her conventional
hypertension medications by "natural" ones as she has too many side effects.
Using TCM I could have had a very good and fast result. I asked one
question: since when do you have hypertension? 14 years ago; what happened
then? My Mum died and her face turned grey. Ignatia solved the whole
situation, we are now weaning her from her conventional medicines.........
no way could I have done that through TCM and BTW her tongue and pulses came
back to normal after Ignatia.
I do use acupuncture (and herbs, and other stuff) a lot to support and help
the patients while the homeopathic treatment acts, or while I manage to find
the proper remedy, or in order to clarify the situation, like replacing
drugs with herbs that will not give symptoms of their own so I do now for
sure what belongs to the patient and what belongs to the drug. But in my
experience, final, long lasting cure is best obtained by homeopathy.........
which does not mean the other modalities cannot do it, just it is a lot more
complicated and time-consuming.
Does that help?????
Dr. J. Rozencwajg, MD, PhD, NMD.
"The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind".

[muthu kumar]

That is a good way of looking at it but I think most of the (really)
holistic medicines treat the whole person and that includes the
present picture and the past baggage. All the diagnostic tools not
only give a picture of the present but also give an explanation of the
pathogenetic mechanism that brought the person to the current
situation. Even in acupuncture it gives you at least an idea of the
possible emotional components that are impacting and the possible
causative factors.

Moreover if you look at it, the same acupuncture points that cure, can
also cause the disease. Felix Mann - British Acupuncturist also talks
about this. In this way the basic mode of action of acupuncture can
also be "like cures like"-Martial arts points are based on this. In
South India there is a martial art called Kalari. The experts in this
also practice a medicine called Varma medicine (which depends on such
points for treatment and is equivalent to Acupuncture). I have heard
the same about some forms of Karate ( Shorinji Kempo for example)
where the healing power of the same points used in attacks are stressed.

If I were to make a decision about what to go for I would go for the 3
or 4 year Acupuncture course to get a License ( L.Ac) to practise
and also attend a good homeopathic course with any one of the good
homeopathic schools. This would enable a solid understanding of both.
L.Ac also gives a better opportunity to practise legally compared to
ND. In my opinion ND is kind of wishy-washy about both Homeopathy and
Chinese Medicine. And I have seen most of the people who come out end
up prescribing more vitamins and nutritional supplements than doing
good homeopathy.
At the same time make sure that you are not spreading yourself too
thin...
--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, "Dr. J. Rozencwajg, MD, PhD,NMD."
wrote:
tongue and
sometimes has
today,
origin,
effects
trigger
ones will
solve the
multiple
conventional
effects.
happened
medicines.........
pulses came
and help
to find
now for
homeopathy.........
lot more

[Luise Kunkle]

Hi Shannon, Kimberly,
Having had a training somewhat äquivalent to naturopathy, following it
up with both acupuncture and homeopathy training, I empathically
agree.

Regards

Luise
I think the advantage to

--
One thought to all who, free of doubt,
So definitely know what's true:
2 and 2 is 22 -
and 2 times 2 is 2:-)
==========> ICQ yinyang 96391801 <==========

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Luise Kunkle]

Hi JROZ,

well, knowing a little about both -not as much as you very likely:-) -
I wonder.
I do mean "wonder" - it is a question not a contradiction. Let us take
your example to demonstrate what I mean:
What happened in this case?

Homeopathically speaking, the life force got thrown off kilter, one
might say the life-force go disbalanced from this shock. Ignatia
re-balnced the life-force.

So Ignatia did what acupuncture would also have done.

There is no telling whether Ignatia removed the disposition of the
life force to be thrown off-balance by some relatively minor
incidence. It *may* have done so. Only long years of follow-up will
tell whether the patient is still prone to be thrown into disbalance
by relatively minor triggerings.

On the side of acupuncture:
There probbly was, at the time of the death and grey face a state of
imbalance of the energies, either constitutionally or for other
reasons. In a good state of balance such minor incidence would not
have caused a severe throwing off-balance.

The symptoms, as pulses, tongue but also rest of the symptoms shown in
the case taking - which should be just as full as with homeopathy and
in which a possible "cause/trigger" should also be looked for - should
show the imbalance as a combination of the "imbalance at time of
incident" and the additionally imbalance caused by the incident.

Treating on that diagnosis a re-balancing of the entire state should
also be possible.

I am not saying that *I* could do that or you or any acupuncturist now
practicing anywhere in the world. I also do not know whether any
homeopath alive would be able to really cure this patient to a point
where such or similar incidents would no longer cause high blood
pressure or other somatic symptoms.

I am here talking about the theory - it is only as far as theory goes
that I can offer any possibly relevant opinions.

Regards

Luise
--
One thought to all who, free of doubt,
So definitely know what's true:
2 and 2 is 22 -
and 2 times 2 is 2:-)
==========> ICQ yinyang 96391801 <==========

[Dr. Joe Rozencwajg, NMD]

Your reasoning is absolutely correct, but many cases similar to the one
quickly presented where for the sake of trying I started with acupuncture
showed this: clear amelioration, but slow, feeling very well, then stalling
and reverting to the previous state although not as bad.
Indeed an argument could be presented that the acupuncture treatment was not
entirely adequate; definitely a possibility of course, yet based on those
experiments I now prefer to use the best indicated therapy for the sake of
speed and patient comfort.
So cases rooted in mental/emotional problems will be treated by homeopathy
unless the physical concern has become independent/one sided, in which case
I will have to add whatever is indicated to the basic original prescription.
Some cases like acute lumbago will need immediate relief that I have never
been able to give with a remedy but almost always with needles.............
my limitations probably but then my concern is the patient, not the theory.
Dr. J. Rozencwajg, MD, PhD, NMD.
"The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind".