case

[Joy Lucas]

Would anyone like to work on this case and guess the remedy that was
prescribed?
Female, 43, 2 children, teacher, average build, reddish hair.

Presenting complaint - menorrhagia and dysmenorrhea

had a d/c 5 years previously - nad
really painful and heavy periods - really bad flooding
always been heavy but <<< last 5 years
pain = both dull and sharp, generally bruised sort of feeling all the time
pain goes from lower back down legs
breasts swell and feel full of blood
nipples especially feel sore
gets very tired with the loss of blood
no obvious aetiology

most of the time, in herself, she feels ok but also has periods of
depression and sadness - she doesn't know why
during this time when she wants to be fussed over by her family but they are
always doing their own thing
she feels she gives a lot to the family and doesn't get enough back during
these times
this can then make her irritable especially during her painful periods
can show her temper but it is soon over, then she feels bad about things
prefers to be alone when she feels like this
tends to get very weepy for no apparent reason
find it very hard to get any work done when she feels tired during her
period

confidence generally ok although she goes through difficult times now and
again - related to feeling unwell
very forgetful, can never remember dates, gets in a muddle at school with
this
admires integrity in people but became quite closed when talking about this
admitted to some suspicion about homeopathy
she came across as someone somewhat aloof, haughty to a certain extent
there is a family feud going on at present which she also preferred not to
talk about

nothing striking re: appetite/foods/thirst - except averse to meats

loves exercise
likes sunny weather but also loves dramatic weather
feels she comes alive during winter, early spring
but overall < cold when she feels unwell
doesn't like humid atmosphere at all

has ringing in her right ear - started suddenly whilst out jogging 2 years
previous

often gets a nosebleed but doesn't last very long

as a child was under pressure to do well
got nervous because of this
went to a polytechnic instead of uni - has a 'chip on her shoulder' because
of this now
likes to do well but not very ambitious

restless sleep + dreams but can never remember them

some constipation with hard stools occasionally
haemorrhoids = itchy, protrude and bleed

all pregnancies and births straightforward

family history of fibroids, arthritis, nervous breakdowns
If you feel like working on the case please send your thoughts and ideas to
the group as a whole.

Best wishes, Joy Lucas

[Jan Klüssendorf]

Hi Joy,

Some quick questions:
Sorry for asking but what is a d/c and what is meant by 'nad'?
The swelling of the breasts etc... is it all the time or before, during
etc... menses?

That's it for now.

Jan

[Joy Lucas]

Hello Jan,

Yes, apologies for using abbreviations

D and C = dilatation and curettage - the cerix is opened and the uterus
scraped with a curette

nad = nothing adverse discovered

the swelling of breasts (which is common enough during menses) occurs then
but it contributes more to a general feeling of fullness and soreness in
the upper part of the abdomen

Hope that helps.

Joy
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[Jan Klüssendorf]

Hi Joy,

Here are my first thoughts about the case.
The causeless sadness and weeping, the irritability when having menses and
with her family, the averse for meat, the love of exercise.... and of
course the painful and to long menses all point to Sep. My first guess.
But because of the pressure from the family to do well, and because of her
compliance to that an the feelings about that afterwards, the love for havy
weather and exercise the aversion to meat I would as well try to make sure
that Carc isn't a better choice to start with.

Jan

[Rosemary Hyde]

Hi, Joy.

The essence of this case seems to correspond closely with Sepia: the
hormonal disturbances at the core of most of the symptoms, the bearing down
pain during menses, the love for physical exertion and "dramatic weather,"
the weariness along with not feeling appreciated and wanting to withdraw
when she has her menses, even the itching hemorrhoids. Sepia is closely
allied with the cancer miasm, so the aspects of this patient's behavior and
preferences that seem to resonate to Carcinosin are also included in Sepia.
I did a survey of small rubrics (less than 5 symptoms) for Sepia and Rhus-t
(the other remedy that may seem close for this list of symptoms). Some of
the interesting small rubrics that contained Sepia were:

MIND - COMPANY - aversion to - menses, during
MIND - IRRITABILITY - weariness - during
FEMALE GENITALIA/SEX - COMPLAINTS of female genitalia - hormonal complaints
GENERALS - PAIN - sore, bruised - menses, during
GENERALS - WEATHER - thunderstorm - during - amel.
Since "dramatic weather" is not in the repertory but thunderstorms are
nothing if not dramatic, I took this small rubric (Carc, Sep, Psor) to be a
good indicator for Sepia, along with the other rubrics in this short list.

Thanks for the exercise -- I'll be interested to see what really worked.
Rosemary Hyde

[andyh]

REPERTORY
FEMALE; MENSES; profuse; general

BACK; PAIN; general; extending to; lower extremities

CHEST; PAIN; general; mammae; nipples; menses; during
MATERIA MEDICA
(CONCORDANT)
Women ENFEEBLED BY LOSS OF BLOOD; WHEN PATIENT LOSES MORE BLOOD THAN IS MADE IN THE INTER-MENSTRUAL PERIOD. Breasts swollen, nipples painful and tender

Profound melancholy.

Remedy: Helonias
=============================================================================
Joy Lucas wrote:
Hello Jan,

Yes, apologies for using abbreviations

D and C = dilatation and curettage - the cerix is opened and the uterus
scraped with a curette

nad = nothing adverse discovered

the swelling of breasts (which is common enough during menses) occurs then
but it contributes more to a general feeling of fullness and soreness in
the upper part of the abdomen

Hope that helps.

Joy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Rosemary Hyde]

Hi, Andy.

Helonias is an intriguing theory, and works well for the menstrual symptoms.
However, this woman had hemorrhoids, which I can't find for Helonias. ???

Just thought it might make for some useful discussion.

Rosemary Hyde

[Jan Klüssendorf]

Hi Rosemary, Andy, others...

Yes, indeed, Andy's idea isn't bad at all.
I wouldn't worry about the fact that in the MM Helonias hasn't haemorrhoids,
because Helonias might have not been tested enough and the absence of a
symptom is mostly not that important, I was learned, but what bothers me
more is that Helonias has clearly exercise.
But for the moment apart from Sep en Carc, I don't have a better guess.
Are there others guesses out there?

Jan

[andyh]

Rosemary Hyde wrote:
Hi Rosemary. Sure, more explanation is warranted for this idea (thanks Joy for your pedagogical sense in presenting these useful cases--this is the list "at its best" in terms of practice and study. Maybe each of us could post an interesting cured case every couple of weeks (I'll put on a short case tonight)).

RE helonias:
Was feeling that the peculiar I chose in the case (pain nipples d. menses) and the primary complaint (profuse menses) and a "third leg" (back pain extending down legs) typify Helonias fairly well, it being primarily a uterine remedy with its concomitant emotional syndrome (sadness, psychosomatic connection between uterus and emotions, etc).. It seems like the uterine problems (with sadness) dominate the picture at present. With loss of blood being excessive, this (could) explain the problems (memory,etc) starting to affect even her work. My theory is that Helonias, being a
somewhat "smaller" remedy (though not a micro remedy, it has about 800 sx in Complete rep), is underlain by some other remedy, perhaps Platinum (haughty schoolteacher). I don't know where the hemorrhoids are in the chronic timeline. I'm guessing it predates the more exaggerated uterine syndrome. There are other symptoms in the case not covered by Helonias as well, so I suspect it may be followed by a "bigger" remedy that predated the past 5 yrs of difficulty (seemingly concordant with the D&C uterine trauma). The family hx has uterine involvement (fibromas) which could
involve Plat or another uterine rem underlying the postulated Helon. Of course there is still the problem of the *bleeding* hemorrhoid. Undoubtedly Joy or others have figured out how to cover the whole case with one rem, like Ham or crot-h or the like. But Helon. low to start and see how the next menses looks would be one way to start, given the uterine provenance, and *despite* the other (and missing) symptoms.

There is some info missing which might help us further, like what is going on with the family; and what is her sexual life doing at this point?

Another idea I had been looking at was crot-h, which has the peculiar memory problem with dates, tinnitus (R side, and it is a "R sided Lach"), might be red-haired, and hemorrhagic menstrual *and* anal bleeding hemorrhoidal) difficulties, and some manner of egocentricity like most snake remedies. But this case did not feel that strident or loquacious, , seemed less forceful than a snake, even some confidence difficulties. Still, the general hemorrhagic tendency combined with the memory weakness for dates could simplify the situation. But it seems to be a force-fit, and I feel
Helon for the proximal uterine layer is still the way to go.
I look forward to having Helonias shot down, of course. Have at it. Thanks Rosemary.

Andy

[elham mohajir]

Didn't try to work put the case but a quick look showed many symptoms looked like Kali-carb
elham