Minutus

It is pipe dream to think that if the USA gets on to a single payer plan that we can nudge them to accept alternative care. They have waged war against alternative health care for the past 175 years, and they aren't going go give up now. As long as government (an agency of force) has any control over health care, we the good guys are screwed, blued, and tattooed. Because the MDs have control over the government.

Have you ever tried to give health advice to someone and they said, "Are you a doctor?" They never said, "Are you a homeopathy?" or "Are you a naturopathic doctor?' or "Are you a chiropractor?". When people including politicians are looking for credentials, they are NOT looking for anything alternative or complementary. They are looking for medical doctors, and medical doctors HATE our guts with every fiber of their being, in general.

Until that changes, which I am not holding my breath over, increasing government involvement will risk more and more of our freedom. It may be that when we first settle into ObamaCare or a single payer system that alternative care will have recognition, but in time the juggernaut of so-called modern so-called medicine will crush us.

It reminds me of the young Soviet Union. In the early 1920's everything was liberal heaven, skinny dipping and the whole nine yards. But when the meanie heads consolidated their power, then the clouds rolled in and the Soviet Union became a gray, drab totalitarian state.

Roger Bird

HI Roger,
Remember there are so some devoted MD's out there doing homeopathy. The government is a big influence, but those individuals who committ themselves to homeopathy are the ones who make change. I think of Roger Morrison, Johnathan Shore... I have been studying from them recently and I am sure they are totally devoted to homeopathy. Let's honor those who serve the common good.

Best,
Ellen

What will nudge us toward acceptance of alternative care, is to take the profit motive out of medicine.
Medicine should be run and done by people who are doing it for love, not as a get-rich-quick scheme.

Hear ye, hear ye!
t
From: Shannon Nelson
Sent: Friday, August 02, 2013 8:45 AM
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Pipe dreams

What will nudge us toward acceptance of alternative care, is to take the profit motive out of medicine.
Medicine should be run and done by people who are doing it for love, not as a get-rich-quick scheme.

Dear Ellen,

That is most certainly true. I didn't know that Roger Morrison was an MD. I knew him long before I read "Divided Legacy", so I didn't make note of the fact that he was an MD.

But these folks, the MDs who are doing complementary healing, are very few and far between. When trying to judge which way the wind is blowing, or which way
society is moving, I have to go with the direction of the overwhelming majority of the people and the MDs. I believe that the Internet and various spiritual forces will eventually move the masses in the direction of complementary medicine, because we are entering a more spiritual era. But as far as healing per se, it is going to be a while, probably a long while. We will have almost free energy in the form of LENR before we have enlightened healing. In fact, LENR will help move people in the direction of enlightened healing. LENR also goes against all theory. [Homeopathy has no materialistic explanation which isn't any more on the fringe than my spiritual explanation.] The "establishment" is completely against both. LENR will soon be impossible to deny, and this will help homeopathy. People will realize that the establishment has let them down big time.

Roger
________________________________

To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
From: ellen.madono@gmail.com
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 19:02:39 +0900
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Pipe dreams

HI Roger,

Remember there are so some devoted MD's out there doing homeopathy. The government is a big influence, but those individuals who committ themselves to homeopathy are the ones who make change. I think of Roger Morrison, Johnathan Shore... I have been studying from them recently and I am sure they are totally devoted to homeopathy. Let's honor those who serve the common good.

Best,
Ellen

The single payer plan, getting the profit motive out of medicine, won't work. It isn't working in the UK where homeopathy etc is being pushed aside and they have had a single payer plan since 1947 (I think, since when the NHS was started). The reasoning against homeopathy in all of the comment sections I have struggled in about this matter is "homeopathy doesn't work so why should we pay for it."

Too many shoulds in your reasoning. Unless you have a practical plan to move towards those shoulds, they are not going to work. I believe that only thing that will work will be a more spiritual culture, which also can't be forced. We have to start and end with ourselves in that regard.

Roger Bird
________________________________

To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
From: shannonnelson@tds.net
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 07:45:07 -0500
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Pipe dreams

What will nudge us toward acceptance of alternative care, is to take the profit motive out of medicine.

Medicine should be run and done by people who are doing it for love, not as a get-rich-quick scheme.

Ellen, I got so carried away that I forget my own bigger attitude with regard to this matter. My first preference is freedom, which I doubt that we will ever get in this country, again. My second preference is the single payer plan. My 3rd preference is what we had before ObamaCare. And my last preference is ObamaCare. Sorry about that.

Roger
________________________________

To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
From: rogerbird2@hotmail.com
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 04:52:29 -0600
Subject: RE: [Minutus] Pipe dreams
Dear Ellen,

That is most certainly true. I didn't know that Roger Morrison was an MD. I knew him long before I read "Divided Legacy", so I didn't make note of the fact that he was an MD.

But these folks, the MDs who are doing complementary healing, are very few and far between. When trying to judge which way the wind is blowing, or which way
society is moving, I have to go with the direction of the overwhelming majority of the people and the MDs. I believe that the Internet and various spiritual forces will eventually move the masses in the direction of complementary medicine, because we are entering a more spiritual era. But as far as healing per se, it is going to be a while, probably a long while. We will have almost free energy in the form of LENR before we have enlightened healing. In fact, LENR will help move people in the direction of enlightened healing. LENR also goes against all theory. [Homeopathy has no materialistic explanation which isn't any more on the fringe than my spiritual explanation.] The "establishment" is completely against both. LENR will soon be impossible to deny, and this will help homeopathy. People will realize that the establishment has let them down big time.

Roger
________________________________

To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
From: ellen.madono@gmail.com
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 19:02:39 +0900
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Pipe dreams

HI Roger,

Remember there are so some devoted MD's out there doing homeopathy. The government is a big influence, but those individuals who committ themselves to homeopathy are the ones who make change. I think of Roger Morrison, Johnathan Shore... I have been studying from them recently and I am sure they are totally devoted to homeopathy. Let's honor those who serve the common good.

Best,
Ellen

my opinion is it all goes back to big pharma. i will accept there are a lot of md's out there that have been brain washed to truly and deeply believe the only scientifically true medicing is what they have been taught, and who funds the medical schools, big pharma, and who runs the FDA, big pharma, it is much more a corruption in the government that is bringing us to where we are. both sides have their hands in the pockets of big pharma, big agro, etc...
we can only get to freedom of choice if we demand it from those we elect. or we fire them and demand honest elected officials that will do the will of the people. we need to speak up as individuals. tell them you are firing them next election.
i don't want to pay for insurance i will never use. like someone else said. my money goes to healthy food, maintaining a healthy immune system and the health care practitioners of my choice. insurance will not cover the health care practitioners of my choice. they do not cover supplements or organic food, although my health care costs are far less than the average American.
people will say what if you get cancer, i would never take chemotherapy drugs, it completely goes against common sense. even before i was into the healthy side of life i still believed people would look back on chemo in the future and see how barbaric it was. like the good old lobotomy for crazy people back in the day.
hey, lets completely destroy our immune system so we can get better??&%&^%&(^&
i wish i could see a revelation of common sense and the people taking back our country in my lifetime. the politicians are now blackmailing each other to force votes in their favor thanks to our ability to completely monitor everything anyone does these days.
all of us here are probably on the radar of big brother because we speak out against the money that runs our government.
the doctors who completely believe only drugs are the answer can only be swayed with proof. the few who have accepted alternative treatments either came from different backgrounds and already had an acceptance or they had something happen in their life where they or a family member could only be cured with alternative treatments. sadly, if they speak out against drugs a=or vaccinations they are blackballed and often could loose their license to go against the CDC and AMA's preachings. not to mention insurance companies might drop them as well.
we can't fight the $$ but we can influence our neighbors, community, family...
don't be afraid to speak up. twitter or whatever if you have to . the stupid media loves to comment on what is "trending" on social media.
real good quality investigative journalism i'll tell you.
jmo
vicki
Join the Campaign to Label GMO's in Florida
We have the Right to Know what is in our Food!
http://www.LabelGMOFlorida.com
Like us @ Label GMO Florida
on Fac ebook and Twitter
"Gluten Free Yummies"
www.GlutenFreeYummies.com

888-Yo-Yummy
________________________________

From: Roger B
To: "Homeopathy minutus@yahoogroups.com"
Sent: Friday, August 2, 2013 1:33 PM
Subject: RE: [Minutus] Pipe dreams
Ellen, I got so carried away that I forget my own bigger attitude with regard to this matter. My first preference is freedom, which I doubt that we will ever get in this country, again. My second preference is the single payer plan. My 3rd preference is what we had before ObamaCare. And my last preference is ObamaCare. Sorry about that.

Roger
________________________________

To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
From: rogerbird2@hotmail.com
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 04:52:29 -0600
Subject: RE: [Minutus] Pipe dreams
Dear Ellen,

That is most certainly true. I didn't know that Roger Morrison was an MD. I knew him long before I read "Divided Legacy", so I didn't make note of the fact that he was an MD.

But these folks, the MDs who are doing complementary healing, are very few and far between. When trying to judge which way the wind is blowing, or which way
society is moving, I have to go with the direction of the overwhelming majority of the people and the MDs. I believe that the Internet and various spiritual forces will eventually move the masses in the direction of complementary medicine, because we are entering a more spiritual era. But as far as healing per se, it is going to be a while, probably a long while. We will have almost free energy in the form of LENR before we have enlightened healing. In fact, LENR will help move people in the direction of enlightened healing. LENR also goes against all theory. [Homeopathy has no materialistic explanation which isn't any more on the fringe than my spiritual explanation.] The "establishment" is completely against both. LENR will soon be impossible to deny, and this will help homeopathy. People will realize that the establishment has let them down big time.

Roger
________________________________

To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
From: ellen.madono@gmail.com
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 19:02:39 +0900
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Pipe dreams

HI Roger,

Remember there are so some devoted MD's out there doing homeopathy. The government is a big influence, but those individuals who committ themselves to homeopathy are the ones who make change. I think of Roger Morrison, Johnathan Shore... I have been studying from them recently and I am sure they are totally devoted to homeopathy. Let's honor those who serve the common good.

Best,
Ellen

taking this thought one step farther, big pharma's got big argo's back has got big dairy industry and big chemical's back (although now the big chemical companies and agro/chem companies. how did our agriculture industry end up in the hands of those making chemical warfare munitions??)
anyhow. as long as the likes of monsanto keep our food quality down, laced with chemicals and keeps the ave. American with infertility problems then they keep the pharma co's in business. as well as treating raw dairy farmers like drug smugglers because God forbid people got food that would make them healthy.
which is one more way to look at the constant war on homeopaths and other alternative health care. if word ever got out in the main street media that it worked, the sheeple might try it and stop buying the drugs and the chemical laced food, etc. they would seek care that actually fixed their ailments, and health care costs would go down dramatically. wouldn't that be awful. a country full of healthy well educated people FREE to make their own choices as to what they ate and how they choose to stay healthy.
but alas, we must prosecute doctors like burkowski (sp??) and gerson and others who have proven nature has the answers to disease. they have turned the Hippocratic oath into just mearly hypocrite.
this is why we must speak up against politicians who don't do the will of the people.
jmo
vicki
Join the Campaign to Label GMO's in Florida
We have the Right to Know what is in our Food!
http://www.LabelGMOFlorida.com
Like us @ Label GMO Florida
on Fac ebook and Twitter
"Gluten Free Yummies"
www.GlutenFreeYummies.com

888-Yo-Yummy
________________________________

From: Label GMO Florida
To: "minutus@yahoogroups.com"
Sent: Friday, August 2, 2013 3:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Pipe dreams
my opinion is it all goes back to big pharma. i will accept there are a lot of md's out there that have been brain washed to truly and deeply believe the only scientifically true medicing is what they have been taught, and who funds the medical schools, big pharma, and who runs the FDA, big pharma, it is much more a corruption in the government that is bringing us to where we are. both sides have their hands in the pockets of big pharma, big agro, etc...
we can only get to freedom of choice if we demand it from those we elect. or we fire them and demand honest elected officials that will do the will of the people. we need to speak up as individuals. tell them you are firing them next election.
i don't want to pay for insurance i will never use. like someone else said. my money goes to healthy food, maintaining a healthy immune system and the health care practitioners of my choice. insurance will not cover the health care practitioners of my choice. they do not cover supplements or organic food, although my health care costs are far less than the average American.
people will say what if you get cancer, i would never take chemotherapy drugs, it completely goes against common sense. even before i was into the healthy side of life i still believed people would look back on chemo in the future and see how barbaric it was. like the good old lobotomy for crazy people back in the day.
hey, lets completely destroy our immune system so we can get better??&%&^%&(^&
i wish i could see a revelation of common sense and the people taking back our country in my lifetime. the politicians are now blackmailing each other to force votes in their favor thanks to our ability to completely monitor everything anyone does these days.
all of us here are probably on the radar of big brother because we speak out against the money that runs our government.
the doctors who completely believe only drugs are the answer can only be swayed with proof. the few who have accepted alternative treatments either came from different backgrounds and already had an acceptance or they had something happen in their life where they or a family member could only be cured with alternative treatments. sadly, if they speak out against drugs a=or vaccinations they are blackballed and often could loose their license to go against the CDC and AMA's preachings. not to mention insurance companies might drop them as well.
we can't fight the $$ but we can influence our neighbors, community, family...
don't be afraid to speak up. twitter or whatever if you have to . the stupid media loves to comment on what is "trending" on social media.
real good quality investigative journalism i'll tell you.
jmo
vicki
Join the Campaign to Label GMO's in Florida
We have the Right to Know what is in our Food!
http://www.LabelGMOFlorida.com
Like us @ Label GMO Florida
on Fac ebook and Twitter
"Gluten Free Yummies"
www.GlutenFreeYummies.com

888-Yo-Yummy
________________________________

From: Roger B
To: "Homeopathy minutus@yahoogroups.com"
Sent: Friday, August 2, 2013 1:33 PM
Subject: RE: [Minutus] Pipe dreams
Ellen, I got so carried away that I forget my own bigger attitude with regard to this matter. My first preference is freedom, which I doubt that we will ever get in this country, again. My second preference is the single payer plan. My 3rd preference is what we had before ObamaCare. And my last preference is ObamaCare. Sorry about that.

Roger
________________________________

To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
From: rogerbird2@hotmail.com
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 04:52:29 -0600
Subject: RE: [Minutus] Pipe dreams
Dear Ellen,

That is most certainly true. I didn't know that Roger Morrison was an MD. I knew him long before I read "Divided Legacy", so I didn't make note of the fact that he was an MD.

But these folks, the MDs who are doing complementary healing, are very few and far between. When trying to judge which way the wind is blowing, or which way
society is moving, I have to go with the direction of the overwhelming majority of the people and the MDs. I believe that the Internet and various spiritual forces will eventually move the masses in the direction of complementary medicine, because we are entering a more spiritual era. But as far as healing per se, it is going to be a while, probably a long while. We will have almost free energy in the form of LENR before we have enlightened healing. In fact, LENR will help move people in the direction of enlightened healing. LENR also goes against all theory. [Homeopathy has no materialistic explanation which isn't any more on the fringe than my spiritual explanation.] The "establishment" is completely against both. LENR will soon be impossible to deny, and this will help homeopathy. People will realize that the establishment has let them down big time.

Roger
________________________________

To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
From: ellen.madono@gmail.com
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 19:02:39 +0900
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Pipe dreams

HI Roger,

Remember there are so some devoted MD's out there doing homeopathy. The government is a big influence, but those individuals who committ themselves to homeopathy are the ones who make change. I think of Roger Morrison, Johnathan Shore... I have been studying from them recently and I am sure they are totally devoted to homeopathy. Let's honor those who serve the common good.

Best,
Ellen

It is happening, at least here in NZ, one patient at a time, through grassroots treatments and discussions with each patient (and subsequently their entourage).
Not only from a therapeutic point of view but from a relationship point of view: a recent patient of mine was laughed at by her specialist when she told him about plans to get natural medicine; her reaction was to ask, no, demand, to be referred to another specialist who would respect her choices even if disagreeing with them. Another patient, a young MS, was told by the neurologist to "go home, listen to music and forget about anything else"; her reaction was to ask the guy if he had a degree; shocked, he answered "yes of course"; then she said "well, I want mine too, so screw you".
The description of the shock and horror on the faces of those practitioners was worth it..........
Well treated patients are fighting back....and I coach them to file a complaint for breach of ethical behaviour too.
There is too much power and money involved at the top to win it from there, just shake it a bit. As we are witnessing everywhere, the power is really with the people.

Joe.
Dr. J. Rozencwajg, NMD. "The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind". www.naturamedica.webs.com
________________________________
________________________________
________________________________