Minutus

A little history on how Bach Remedies got into the HPUS
"*regarding HPCUS on the label
this from Julian Winston, when we had this discussion on the Lyghtforce
list:*

In the early 1970s the importer of Bach Stuff in the USA pushed the 38
through the Pharmacopoeia Committee. He was a strong guy and it was a
weak committee. So the 30 Bach flowers ARE in the Homeopathic
Pharmacopoeia. BUT **BUT** The method of manufacture isn’t.

"The flowers of the Bach Flower Remedies were approved in the early days
by the HPCUS for inclusion in the Pharmacopoeia as *Class C tinctures*
that is the flowers are macerated in Alcohol and water for 14+ days and
expressed, to obtain a tincture.

The dichotomy in preparation (Class C vs the "sun extraction" method)
was pointed out to the sponsors years ago when they were approved, the
sponsor simply cared about getting them official and let the chips fall
on methods of preparation. I suppose that the remedies prepared
according to the Bach methodology are actually misbranded, but at this
point no one has investigated them and likely FDA doesn't care. That's
why no homeopathic pharmacy in the USA makes them. If they did it
legally, they would be making a different product than the traditional one.

The ones that people have that are labeled as "HPCUS" were done so to
make it seem like the product was official, when it really wasn't.

I am concerned about the ones labeled "5X" since this implies
homeopathic process and dilution‘ something the Bach remedies are not."

So Walnut FLOWER is described, but only a method using alcohol to
extract the tincture of the flower.
Then, since they were IN the HPCUS, the mfg. began to sell them as
"homeopathic" (so he could legally import them) and said they were 5X.
That's the USA story."
Even though Bach Remedies are not Proved(en) or made based on the Homeopathic Pharmacopeia, they were included in the Homeopathic Pharmacopoeia of the United States (HPUS) in the early 1980's.
The pharmacopoeia says nothing about making the remedies by soaking the petals of the flowers in water in the full sun.
and
Interesting article by Peter Morrell "The Bach Flower Remedies and Homeopathy"
http://homeoint.org/morrell/articles/bach.htm
--
Imagine Peace
http://www.homeopathicsolutions.blogspot.com/

Didn't the need for the 5X labelling also come from the UK where they could only be manufactured and sold if labelled with some sort of ingredient quantity ... so 5X was chosen as a close proximity, nothing else being possible?

Kind Regards,

Fran Sheffield

One of the pharmacists from the UK could probably answer your question.

Tony Pinkus from Ainsworth did have this to say in 2009

Although Bach distinctly says in his writings that his flower essences are
not homoeopathic the company that makes Rescue Remedy, insists that the only
way in which they can maintain sales of this and other Bach flower remedies
is to make everyone believe that they are.

Hence the change on the label from 1:240 dilution in brandy to 5x dilution
in 'grape alcohol' Firstly this is a large jump not justified by the
literature secondly grape alcohol is no longer pure brandy.

As a reaction to this, we at Ainsworths got fed up and decided to make our
own Bach flower remedies accordingly to how Bach made them.

I can reassure you that ours are not succussed. Also that since 5x on a
label does not imply serial dilution and succussion it cannot be claimed
that any other brand is either.
Lynn
________________________________
--
Imagine Peace
http://www.homeopathicsolutions.blogspot.com/

For a few years, during NZ homeopathic conferences, we were repeatedly treated to the description and methodology of treating cancer patients in some Indian Homeopathic Hospitals, with fascinating results.
But every time, in addition to the remedy/ies, patients were given "Bach Flowers Remedies in 30C" (sic).

As you imagine, the speakers were immediately challenged about potentising BFRs.

The answer, coming from head of departments of teaching homeopathic public hospitals with University legal status was......are you ready.... "that is how we do it!"
Even individual, personal conversations could not extract an explanation, indication, any other information about this.

Puts a serious damper on believing the results or anything else!

If somebody found out that potentising BFRs gives them different properties, I certainly would like to know it............

Joe.

Dr. J. Rozencwajg, NMD. "The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind". www.naturamedica.webs.com
________________________________

--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, Fran Sheffield wrote:

--------
Hi Fran,

http://www.bach-flower-therapy.com/fund ... /index.php

The British Homoeopathic Pharmacopoeia provides detailed information about the methods how to prepare the Bach mother tinctures:

"Method BR9 preparation of a Bach mother tincture by the Sun Method:

The Sun Method is used to prepare mother tinctures from flowers which bloom during the late spring and the summer when the sun is most powerful. The operation is carried out at the site of the plants or trees, starting at around 9am on a sunny settled day. 50 parts of water are added to a suitably sized glass container, ensuring the level of water reaches the brim. 1 part of flower-heads, picked just below the calyx or the flowering spikes, is floated on the surface of the water in the glass container. This is left for 3 hours in full sunshine. The flower-heads are then removed and the water filtered into a glass bottle. This is the basic Bach mother tincture, prepared by the Sun Method. It is mixed with an equal volume of Brandy and vigorously shaken. It should be stored in a cool dark place.

This is further diluted 1 part in 500 with ethanol (22%) w/w.
This final dilution approximates to the homoeopathic potency 5X"
---------
"Method BR10 preparation of a Bach mother tincture by the Boiling Method:

The Boiling Method is used to prepare mother tinctures from flowers and twigs of the trees, bushes and plants which bloom early in the year before there is much sunshine. At about 9am on a sunny settled day, sufficient flowering sprays and leaves are collected to provide 1 part of plant material, which is placed in a glass vessel and 10 parts of water added. This is boiled for half an hour then allowed to cool. The solution is then decanted and filtered into a glass bottle. This is the basic Bach mother tincture, prepared by the Boiling Method. It is mixed with an equal volume of Brandy and vigorously shaken. It should be stored in a cool dark place.

This is further diluted 1 part in 500 with ethanol (22%) w/w. This final dilution approximates to the homoeopathic potency 5X"
------------------

Think this is the same dilution mentioned above???

"The Mother Tinctures arrive at the Nelsons bottling plant in Wimbledon, South London. To make the individual stock bottles you buy in shops, the Mother Tincture is added to 27% grape alcohol. The stock bottles are then packed up, sealed for safety and quality and dispatched to stores and countries around the world."

Atb,

Leilanae

In cases that were slow to respond (eg Agrimony as that involves stuffing things internally and it can take some doing to release them) I have tried 1C and found it effective (for the same symptoms known to be associated with that remedy).
....Irene
REPLY TO: only
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

Thanks Leilanae,

I have read in the past that 5X HAD to be placed on the bottle to satisfy marketing and regulating requirements but can't remember who said it to know how true it may have been. I guess the manufacturers would be the best people to give an answer to this if any one is strongly interested.

Kind Regards,

Fran Sheffield