Minutus

A good friend of mine, age 92, up till now doing well -- mobile, active, involved -- fell and broke her pelvis a couple of days ago. I’m sending Symphytum, to help the fracture heal more rapidly. In my experience, fracture in people of advanced age leads to enough disturbance and lack of mobility that often, they have a hard time ever regaining either independent locomotion or their mental acumen. Does anyone have any thoughts about a remedy that might help to preserve muscle function (and brain function) so that the person is able to get up after the bone has healed enough, and move around again? Doctors and hospitals seem to totally disregard this risk, and with a fractured pelvis, I can imagine that moving again could be even harder than with a fractured hip.
Rosemary
"In April, we cannot see sunflowers in France, so we might say the
sunflowers do not exist. But the local farmers have already planted
thousands of seeds, and when they look at the bare hills, they may be
able to see the sunflowers already. The sunflowers are there. They lack
only the conditions of sun, heat, rain and July. Just because we cannot
see them does not mean that they do not exist."
-- Thich Nhat Hanh

I suppose would depend on state ,health ruined ?chelidonium. Maybe constitutional. Maybe Arnica. I would think physio necessary. TLC would help and good nutrition. I hope she finds the energy to recover. Best Wishes Jean.

Hi Rosemary,
I’m working with this exact situation at the moment – hence my request for information on the pace of Lathyrus sativus (unfortunately no responses). I have worked with many of these cases and there seem to be two major problems. First – the standard medical protocol typically centers on pain killers – so the individual does not move enough – and the muscles start to waste. The pain killers also dull appetite AND cause constipation – so the ability to receive and absorb nutrients is a major problem. Second – the standard medical ‘therapy’ does not expect much if any recovery – and this message is repeated over and over to a drugged mind of the injured individual – who begins to believe them. There was a wonderful article recently on ‘expectation in recovery’ that clearly showed the role of attitudes of doctors, therapists and care givers – not only their words, but their willingness to move and feed the elderly injured, not to mention overmedicate - was a major factor in decline and death – I’ll try to find it for you.
What has worked well in many of my similar cases (of course it is determined individually) has been Symphytum and Arnica in the early stages, followed by cell salts and liquid vitamins (split into very small frequent doses) and plenty of liquid fiber (fresh veggie and fruit juices) and protein laden soups. This does not sit well with the caregivers who must either change diapers frequently or help the individual to a bedside commode. The therapists must be encouraged to consider recovery defined as mobile and active lifestyle – not bedridden. The medication must be modified so the individual can get good rest, but still has enough ‘awake’ time to move around, take therapy, and operate the brain. I do think the B vitamins ( particularly B12) are important in protecting the nerve connections and brain function – see if the Dr will give B12 injections. The worst problem I see all the time is the hospital dietitian – and the prescription of those liquid meals (i.e. Ensure, etc.). Yikes – just read those ingredients!
Remedy selection during recovery is very difficult. You are working against medications effect on their memory and vocabulary - and may not get accurate information from the individual. Also, the remedies do not seem to hold well – again I think the medications are part of that issue.
Best,
Donna
D C Rona, PhD, ND, DHM
________________________________

From: minutus@yahoogroups.com [mailto:minutus@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rosemary Hyde
Sent: Friday, May 22, 2009 9:21 AM
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Minutus] Wasting in elderly
A good friend of mine, age 92, up till now doing well -- mobile, active, involved -- fell and broke her pelvis a couple of days ago. I’m sending Symphytum, to help the fracture heal more rapidly. In my experience, fracture in people of advanced age leads to enough disturbance and lack of mobility that often, they have a hard time ever regaining either independent locomotion or their mental acumen. Does anyone have any thoughts about a remedy that might help to preserve muscle function (and brain function) so that the person is able to get up after the bone has healed enough, and move around again? Doctors and hospitals seem to totally disregard this risk, and with a fractured pelvis, I can imagine that moving again could be even harder than with a fractured hip.
Rosemary
"In April, we cannot see sunflowers in France, so we might say the
sunflowers do not exist. But the local farmers have already planted
thousands of seeds, and when they look at the bare hills, they may be
able to see the sunflowers already. The sunflowers are there. They lack
only the conditions of sun, heat, rain and July. Just because we cannot
see them does not mean that they do not exist."
-- Thich Nhat Hanh

I think the tissue salts would be a good idea to consider, possibly Calc fluor for the muscle/tissue building but it would depend on how the case progresses and what comes to the fore, if it be a general weakness then Kali phos used as a tissue salt would be good.

Joy

http://www.joylucashomeopathy.com
http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/homeopathystudy/

Thanks so much, Donna. Yes, I’ve seen the same things, and it’s totally scary. I appreciate your sharing your experience of what might help.
Warmly, Rosemary
"Imagination is the beginning of creation. You imagine what you desire, you will what you imagine and at last you create what you will."
~George Bernard Shaw
From: minutus@yahoogroups.com [mailto:minutus@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of d rona
Sent: Friday, May 22, 2009 9:56 AM
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Minutus] Wasting in elderly
Hi Rosemary,
I’m working with this exact situation at the moment – hence my request for information on the pace of Lathyrus sativus (unfortunately no responses). I have worked with many of these cases and there seem to be two major problems. First – the standard medical protocol typically centers on pain killers – so the individual does not move enough – and the muscles start to waste. The pain killers also dull appetite AND cause constipation – so the ability to receive and absorb nutrients is a major problem. Second – the standard medical ‘therapy’ does not expect much if any recovery – and this message is repeated over and over to a drugged mind of the injured individual – who begins to believe them. There was a wonderful article recently on ‘expectation in recovery’ that clearly showed the role of attitudes of doctors, therapists and care givers – not only their words, but their willingness to move and feed the elderly injured, not to mention overmedicate - was a major factor in decline and death – I’ll try to find it for you.
What has worked well in many of my similar cases (of course it is determined individually) has been Symphytum and Arnica in the early stages, followed by cell salts and liquid vitamins (split into very small frequent doses) and plenty of liquid fiber (fresh veggie and fruit juices) and protein laden soups. This does not sit well with the caregivers who must either change diapers frequently or help the individual to a bedside commode. The therapists must be encouraged to consider recovery defined as mobile and active lifestyle – not bedridden. The medication must be modified so the individual can get good rest, but still has enough ‘awake’ time to move around, take therapy, and operate the brain. I do think the B vitamins ( particularly B12) are important in protecting the nerve connections and brain function – see if the Dr will give B12 injections. The worst problem I see all the time is the hospital dietitian – and the prescription of those liquid meals (i.e. Ensure, etc.). Yikes – just read those ingredients!
Remedy selection during recovery is very difficult. You are working against medications effect on their memory and vocabulary - and may not get accurate information from the individual. Also, the remedies do not seem to hold well – again I think the medications are part of that issue.
Best,
Donna
D C Rona, PhD, ND, DHM
________________________________

From: minutus@yahoogroups.com [mailto:minutus@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rosemary Hyde
Sent: Friday, May 22, 2009 9:21 AM
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Minutus] Wasting in elderly
A good friend of mine, age 92, up till now doing well -- mobile, active, involved -- fell and broke her pelvis a couple of days ago. I’m sending Symphytum, to help the fracture heal more rapidly. In my experience, fracture in people of advanced age leads to enough disturbance and lack of mobility that often, they have a hard time ever regaining either independent locomotion or their mental acumen. Does anyone have any thoughts about a remedy that might help to preserve muscle function (and brain function) so that the person is able to get up after the bone has healed enough, and move around again? Doctors and hospitals seem to totally disregard this risk, and with a fractured pelvis, I can imagine that moving again could be even harder than with a fractured hip.
Rosemary
"In April, we cannot see sunflowers in France, so we might say the
sunflowers do not exist. But the local farmers have already planted
thousands of seeds, and when they look at the bare hills, they may be
able to see the sunflowers already. The sunflowers are there. They lack
only the conditions of sun, heat, rain and July. Just because we cannot
see them does not mean that they do not exist."
-- Thich Nhat Hanh

Hi, Rosemary
I'm so sorry about your friend's injury. Perhaps, in addition to vitamins, cell salts, and dietary help, you might think about remedies for shock. In addition to the pain of the original trauma, the sudden loss of mobility and enforced dependence is a shock. How is your friend taking it? What emotions has it stirred up in her? I think the M/E state needs to be considered.
Peace,
Dale

Hi, Dale.
The idea of shock is undoubtedly a good one. Unfortunately, she lives at a great distance from me, and I don’t have an astute observer on site to give me a good emotional picture. I’ll ask, though, and see what I can find out. I think that what Donna suggested about medication dulling the mind is undoubtedly what’s going on. Whatever opiate they’re giving, it’s also nauseating her, to the point of dehydration, and I told them someone needs to speak up and pressure the doctor to prescribe an alternate medication so that doesn’t continue. I can’t believe they’re just proceeding with the same med despite the extreme nausea – actually I can believe, but I find it really distressing. It just adds more layers to the trauma.
Thanks to everyone for their excellent suggestions!
Rosemary
"Imagination is the beginning of creation. You imagine what you desire, you will what you imagine and at last you create what you will."
~George Bernard Shaw
From: minutus@yahoogroups.com [mailto:minutus@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dale Moss
Sent: Friday, May 22, 2009 10:45 PM
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Wasting in elderly
Hi, Rosemary
I'm so sorry about your friend's injury. Perhaps, in addition to vitamins, cell salts, and dietary help, you might think about remedies for shock. In addition to the pain of the original trauma, the sudden loss of mobility and enforced dependence is a shock. How is your friend taking it? What emotions has it stirred up in her? I think the M/E state needs to be considered.
Peace,

Dale

Hi Donna,

I've not used Lath. Sat., nor read of anyone with several cured cases
.. contributing a feel for the pace of the remedy.

However, in reading poisonings in T.F. Allen's encyclopedia
it is clear that the material dose has caused paraplegia with
parasthesia; permanent paralysis of the lower limbs,
which for some seemed to come on overnight (now that is fast paced !)

-from this I intuit that the various symptoms of the Rx might be best
thought of in relation to spinal injury or some other serious
paralytic scenario, rather than "weakness of the lower limbs." It's
use in locomotor ataxia would again be nerve-related.

Further reading in Anshutz "New Old & Forgotten remedies"
-there is a small section "correspondence to spinal disorders"
.. where the "picture" of lath.sat poisoning is offered to be
extremely similar to spastic paraplegia.
Anshutz gives a few one-line clinical references...
-which give rise to the idea that the pace of the material poison may
bear no resemblance to the pace of the homeopathic rx; it is being
given in 3x potency;
cases include "multiple sclerosis in man of 28 yrs, who was ill for
seven years and unable to walk for six 'greatly benefited' by lath.sat
3x"
"paraplegia coming on after 'a stroke' 'from exposure to wet' cured
in 8 months" (3x potency)

So, it seems after all.. as if the pace of the Rx is indeterminant.
Likely, using LM potency scale & liquid posology will give faster cure.

I have doubts about using this Rx in other than paralytic dis-ease
which affects only from the waist down.
Many indications of "onset, sudden" and "brought on &/or aggravated
by exposure to wet weather."
-but.. at least one "cured case" in a long standing paralysis which
had an onset of longer than one year.
warm wishes,
david 510.776.5914 fax: 510.336.6671
www.holistiq.com
www.DavidHartley.com
I.T. support: www.cafegratitude.com
co-founder: www.GratefulMindandBody.com
web developer: www.iamResourceful.com

an older woman (mother of an acquaintance) broke her hip last year.
this was a very vibrant and active woman all her life. her pain and healing
were not progressing at all. the obstacle to cure was her fear of dying in
a nursing home. her perspective was that when an older person had such
an injury they wound up in a nursing home and died. her fear of death was
so great that she went into depression and the healing was not happening.
it took much family

Hmm, that's why I always consider using a dose of Aconite (fear of death) *in the first instance* after a severe trauma involving broken bones - i.e. *before* Arnica, Bryonia, Rhus tox, or Symphytum etc. Reducing or eliminating the initial fright and shock prepares the constitutional terrain for the rest of the physical healing to take place. We shouldn't forget that the stress of the initial fright (and how it is perceived by the person) can be stored within the constitutional terrain for a very, very long time, and as you say Tanya, it can become an obstacle to cure...
Chris.