Molluscum again - vital force reactivity

[Gail]

....and I had another thought about switched off immune systems - Now
I'm a bit fuzzy on these details, it comes from a TV documentary that I
saw a couple of years ago - Apparently people with Crohn's disease (or
it might have been Ulcerative Colitis) can ameliorate their symptoms by
becoming infested with worms. The worms somehow dampen down the immune
system reactivity and are the lesser of two evils for the sufferers. The
show actually had footage of a sufferer downing their dose of worms (it
might have just been the eggs, but I remember being grossed out by it.)

Where this line of thinking is taking me is first to the possibility
that a parasite infestation may be able to block the Vital Force's
ability to react well to a remedy, and the next step is to the MM of a
Cancer nosode - Scirrhinum - which Clarke had as his standby remedy for
threadworms.

Gail

PS further to the raw egg discussion which I followed with interest
having fond memories of eggnog with vanilla and brandy- these eggs must
have been raw as well....
--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, Gail Allen wrote:
well to set up the inflammation.
anymore? Too many vaccinations of course is a possibility. Wonder if
it's about EMF stuff - so cell phone? Or maybe the kids should be
allowed to throw a really high temperature without it being suppressed
by panadol (or even aconite). Wonder if there's been a proving of
Panadol? Or maybe look at the Cancer miasm remedies to switch the
reaction back on because my understanding is that in cancer the body
should be attacking the cancer cells but somehow the vital force doesn't
respond to the danger.
looking for the NWS point that stops the vital force from getting rid of
them.
+0100Subject: Fw: Fw: [Minutus] Molluscum again!! ( My Compiled
Molluscum File)

I saw her last but that is it!!
Practitionerwww.southporthomeopathy.co.uk
body will set up an inflammatory response and attack all of them - it
worked for a friend with her daughter a few years ago.Gail---

[Shannon Nelson]

It would be interesting to see how these folks do *long-term*!
In the homeopathic framework, a disease can be made to go away either
via (a) cure from a similar disease, whereby they annihilate each other
(meaning the worms die out and the Crohns or whatever is cured?), or
(b) by being supplanted by a *stronger disease*, in other words by
leaving the person worse off than they were before. I wonder which is
happening here??? (Or, if they have to continue taking the worms,
perhaps it's just a grosser-than-usual form of palliation?)

Shannon

[Soroush Ebrahimi]

I saw a similar programme where the patient with severe pollen reactivity was infected monthly with a tape worm (which was killed at the end of the month) and his symptoms improved to the degree that it was able to work in greenhouses.

Regards

Soroush

[Irene de Villiers]

On Apr 11, 2008, at 8:09 PM,
wrote:

Dear Soroush,
Are you sure it was tape worm and not mycobacteria in this case?

The immune system has Th1 cytokines responsible for fighting bacteria
and viruses - and also Th2 cytokines responsible for fighting parasites.

Thus if someone has a Th-1 skewed disease (overproduction of Th-1
cytokines) such as colitis/Chrohn's disease, then the introduction
of a parasite to stimulate Th-2 cytokine production, can help to
regulate the balance between Th1 and Th2 which is needed for
health....and this will improve the Chrohn's disease.

However if one has a Th2 skewed disease like allergy - then Th2
cytokines are overproduced and you need to stimulate the Th1 side of
the immune system to restore balance - which can be done by
introducing bacteria such as mycobacteria. Introducing tapeworm would
actually make allergies worse as tapeworm *increases* the already too
high Th2 response.

Namaste,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

[Soroush Ebrahimi]

Hi Irene
My memory may be playing games with me, but that is what I remember.

Regards

Soroush

[Gail]

Yes, they had to keep taking regular doses of the worms - but the
programme didn't say anything about killing them off like in Dr J's tape
worm story.

Because they are dampening down the immune response it would have to be
an example of a dissimilar treatment.

That whole T1 and T2 cell thing is so confusing for me Irene - Are
autoimmune and allergy part of the same T cell shift?

Gail.
--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, Robert & Shannon Nelson
wrote:
other
Now
that
(or
immune
a
working
suppressed
rid
it

[Pauline Ashford]

HI Gail I remember this documentary it was regarding allergic rhinitis and crohns – evidently the worms secrete a substance(s) that reduce the ‘watchfulness’ of the immune system and it decreases symptoms in hypersensitivity reactions with – according to the documentary – very good results in those that the medical system had given up on as ‘too hard’. They worked on the premise – I think – that the human body has over the ages become so used to worm parasitic invasions that the body(s) had come to rely on the symbiotic relationship in some ‘constitutional types” (my interpretation) that without they were constantly plagues with hypersensitivity reactions. Regards Pauline
From: minutus@yahoogroups.com [mailto:minutus@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Gail
Sent: Friday, 11 April 2008 9:49 PM
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Minutus] Re: Molluscum again - vital force reactivity
....and I had another thought about switched off immune systems - Now
I'm a bit fuzzy on these details, it comes from a TV documentary that I
saw a couple of years ago - Apparently people with Crohn's disease (or
it might have been Ulcerative Colitis) can ameliorate their symptoms by
becoming infested with worms. The worms somehow dampen down the immune
system reactivity and are the lesser of two evils for the sufferers. The
show actually had footage of a sufferer downing their dose of worms (it
might have just been the eggs, but I remember being grossed out by it.)

Where this line of thinking is taking me is first to the possibility
that a parasite infestation may be able to block the Vital Force's
ability to react well to a remedy, and the next step is to the MM of a
Cancer nosode - Scirrhinum - which Clarke had as his standby remedy for
threadworms.

Gail

PS further to the raw egg discussion which I followed with interest
having fond memories of eggnog with vanilla and brandy- these eggs must
have been raw as well....

--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com , Gail Allen wrote:
well to set up the inflammation.
anymore? Too many vaccinations of course is a possibility. Wonder if
it's about EMF stuff - so cell phone? Or maybe the kids should be
allowed to throw a really high temperature without it being suppressed
by panadol (or even aconite). Wonder if there's been a proving of
Panadol? Or maybe look at the Cancer miasm remedies to switch the
reaction back on because my understanding is that in cancer the body
should be attacking the cancer cells but somehow the vital force doesn't
respond to the danger.
looking for the NWS point that stops the vital force from getting rid of
them.
+0100Subject: Fw: Fw: [Minutus] Molluscum again!! ( My Compiled
Molluscum File)

I saw her last but that is it!!
Practitionerwww.southporthomeopathy.co.uk
body will set up an inflammatory response and attack all of them - it
worked for a friend with her daughter a few years ago.Gail---

[Irene de Villiers]

Hi Gail,
Auto-immune (=immune system not preventing damage to the individual
due to being out of balance) means that EITHER Th-1 or TH-2 immune
system cytokine responses are out of balance. So there are two
categories of auto-immune diseases:
* Those that that have too much Th-1 cytokine and too little Th-2
cytokine (like multiple sclerosis and Crohns disease for examnple) and
* There are also autoimmune diseases that are "Th-2 skewed" namely
have too much Th-2 cytokine activity and too little Th-1 cytokine
activity (like allergies, cancer, arthritis, fibromyalgia, for example).

So - basically, any Th-skewed condition can predispose auto-immune
disease.
There are many Th-1 and Th-2 cytokines and each disease has a unique
ratio of them - but that's getting into too much detail. I just
mention it as the Th-1 and Th-2 divisions are fairly broad. It is
nevertheless customary to categorize the diseases by the
preponderance of either Th-1 or Th-2 cytokines.

In general, Th-1 cytokines are those that help against viruses and
bacteria and against chronic disease, especially at the cell level.
In general Th-2 cytokines are those that help against parasites and
against acute disease, such as with antibodies from the bone marrow.
Auto-immune diseases involve *over-activity* of either of these.

Does that help?

Namaste,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

[Irene de Villiers]

The original post said:

Worms would help against colitis but would aggravate allergy.
This is because worms are parasites and that excites the Th-2 immune
system cytokines, and allergies occur due to too *many* Th-2
cytokines so adding more is a mistake and would make allergies get
worse with worms present.
Colitis however would improve with worms present as colitis occurs
due to too *few* Th-2 cytokines, and worms would increase the Th-2
cytokines and help the colitis.

This is quite well documented in research by the way, and is logical
for the way the immune system functions.

Namaste,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

[Pauline Ashford]

HI Irene - I understand what you are saying but the allergy sufferers
reported in the doco reported much improved symptoms???? So there must be
some mechanism that worked for them?? Pauline