Minutus

Dear all, Has anyone had experience with/or treated atrophic
gastritis? This was diagnosed by gastroscopy a month ago and
further confirmed by biopsy which also indicated lymphocytic
gastritis and a marked degree of intestinal metaplasia. My
Specialist considers the condition to be very rare and uncurable and
my GP admits to never having heard of it.

At present I am experiencing constant nausea and weight loss due to a
very restrictive diet. I am sensitive to many foods, including
vitamins and the typical supplements which one would take to
counteract weight loss.

I have had digestive system problems since the early 1970's, my first
gastroscopy being in 1971 which showed giant rugae.

I am a Classical Homoeopath, practicing for 15 years and have tried a
number of remedies some of which have palliated the condition short
term. Several experienced homoeopath colleagues have offered
suggestions but so far none have hit the nail on the head.
The only references to the condition in repertories that I know of
are in Murphy and Phatak, and it also comes up in ISIS under stomach -
atrophy.

This leads me to the question of how the rubric for the condition was
arrived at, particularly in terms of written repertories.
Obviously, the condition could not have been diagnosed on the basis
of symptoms as the only ways of establishing its presence would be
through gastroscopy or biopsy.

I will be most interested to have comments from other members of
Minutus, particularly those who have had experience with this
condition.

Kind regards to you all,

Elaine

Dr Ramnakrishnan would think of Hydrastis, Cadmuim Sulph, Ars Alb, Kali Bic and Ornithogallum as organ remedies for the stomach. This sounds like a precancerous condition.. I would look at the Cadmiums in particular . He would alternate his method with another remedy ?Carcinocin or the constitutional. using his protocol of plussing.. Also I am very interested in what Dr Grimmer says about the Cadmiums and cancer, Say if very thirsty think of Cadmium Phos???/ Best Wishes ,Jean

HI Elaine – while I have not ever treated this condition –

I have heard of a form of it which often comes as a consequence of aging –( I realise that yours may not be this form )

– the nutrition text I had uni last year states that it can “affect up to 1/3 of all people over 60(!!!!!) – characterized by an inflamed stomach, bacterial overgrowth, lack of hydrochloric acid and intrinsic factor. All of which can impair the digestion and absorption of nutrients particularly, B12 but also biotin, folate, calcium, iron and zinc” Book also says it can developed in response to iron deficiency or infection by helicobacter’ Ref: E Whitney & S Rolfes, 2008, Understanding Nutrition, 11th ed, Thomson Wordworth Pages 343,599
– but as a suggestion – one of the things caused by the atrophy is lack of secretions in the stomach – particularly intrinsic factor – therefore there is often B12 deficiency – which further exacerbates the bodies ability to heal itself and has its own set of symptoms – many sufferers of the aging form do much better when given B12 by injection. As B12 deficiency is usually insidious as far as symptoms go until the nerve damage is irreversible – I would suggest looking at this sooner than later. Please forgive me if you are already doing this.
http://autoimmunedisease.suite101.com/a ... _gastritis

http://www.merck.com/mmpe/sec02/ch013/ch013d.html
is also discussed here.
Have the Drs investigated the helicobacter link???

I don’t know about others but I have used the helicobacter nosode 30 remedy in patients that have positive test results and actually have had 2 patients who have tested clear after a positive reading – by using the helicobacter remedy along with their constitutional and no allopathic treatment.

Haven’t had such good (fast and held) results with the constitutional alone

I usually give it as a water potency – once a day in ascending dilutions – ie first day done in one dilution glass – give one tsp as dose – retain glass and next day use one tsp of that glass into new glass stir and one tsp as a dose – retain the glass and next day use one tsp of this into a new glass etc etc

Then I give it once a week for 4 weeks. I know I will be chastised for routinism – but after not being able to find any info on how to give it I went to what I worked out works with the candida nosode and so far have had good results with it – I always use the constitutional with it.
Regards Pauline
From: minutus@yahoogroups.com [mailto:minutus@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of jill_j2804
Sent: Thursday, 20 March 2008 3:18 PM
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Minutus] atrophic gastritis
Dear all, Has anyone had experience with/or treated atrophic
gastritis? This was diagnosed by gastroscopy a month ago and
further confirmed by biopsy which also indicated lymphocytic
gastritis and a marked degree of intestinal metaplasia. My
Specialist considers the condition to be very rare and uncurable and
my GP admits to never having heard of it.

At present I am experiencing constant nausea and weight loss due to a
very restrictive diet. I am sensitive to many foods, including
vitamins and the typical supplements which one would take to
counteract weight loss.

I have had digestive system problems since the early 1970's, my first
gastroscopy being in 1971 which showed giant rugae.

I am a Classical Homoeopath, practicing for 15 years and have tried a
number of remedies some of which have palliated the condition short
term. Several experienced homoeopath colleagues have offered
suggestions but so far none have hit the nail on the head.

The only references to the condition in repertories that I know of
are in Murphy and Phatak, and it also comes up in ISIS under stomach -
atrophy.

This leads me to the question of how the rubric for the condition was
arrived at, particularly in terms of written repertories.
Obviously, the condition could not have been diagnosed on the basis
of symptoms as the only ways of establishing its presence would be
through gastroscopy or biopsy.

I will be most interested to have comments from other members of
Minutus, particularly those who have had experience with this
condition.

Kind regards to you all,

Elaine

I doubt I can add anything useful. It rings a bell because there is a
form of FIP in cats which involves similar kinds of gastric damage,
with extreme difficulty assimilating food (or eliminating waste for
that matter) but not the same as you describe. I have a current case
responding to Bryonia, chosen partly because along with the severe
damage to the intestinal area and colon area, the cat also has
involvement of the eyes (uveitis) which was relevant in selecting Bry.

On PubMed I found this reference:

Am J Gastroenterol. 1997 Jun;92(6):1041-3.Ménétrier's disease: a new
variant with duodenal involvement.
Wu CS, Lin CJ, Chen TC, Chen PC, Chiu CC.
Department of Medicine, Chang Gung Memorial Hospital, Taipei, Taiwan,
Republic of China.
" Ménétrier's disease is a rare cause of hypertrophic gastropathy,
usually confined to gastric body and fundus, which is characterized
by giant rugae, hypoalbuminemia, and foveolar hyperplasia. The
etiology of this disease is still unknown. We report a case of a 74-
yr-old man who had dyspepsia, hypoalbuminemia, weight loss, and
diffuse polypoid, nodular lesions affecting the whole stomach and
proximal duodenum on gastroscopy and barium meal study. The histology
of gastric and duodenal mucosal lesions fulfilled the diagnosis of
Ménétrier's disease, that was not described to involve duodenum in
the literature. The disease resolved clinically, endoscopically, and
pathologically after therapy with famotidine [Irene comment = Pepsid]
for 3 months. We speculated that extensive pyloric metaplasia and
then foveolar hyperplasia of duodenum in this patient might be a
variant of Ménétrier's disease with favorable clinical course."

You might search PubMed for other refs too, in case they help or
apply to your situation.
Sensitivity at that severity indicates a very skewed immune system
(Th-2 skewed) and one supplement I take for my badly skewed system
(for different reasons) is Moducare. In your case, I'd suggest
getting capsules from South Africa (any Clicks drugstore) as the
American made version under license has way too many "fillers". Then
you can empty the capsles into food, to avoid the capsule dyes and
content. I use 6 a day, and know the difference if i skip them.
Content is extracted plant sterols and sterolins that help enhance
Th-1 response.

I work mainly with Th-2 skewed diseases in cats and it is my opinion
that the remedies that match them, DO re-balance the immune system,
without which the cats would not recover.
So I might use seemingly unrelated rubrics if they suit Th-2 skewed
illness - as the need to undo Th-2 skewing is really serious these
days with all the vaccines, chemicals and soy products we are
subjected to - and is common to many chronic situations. It widens my
remedy selections when I do this though it is not classical - more
scientific and logical, and "similar":-) I do it because the
diseases I work with have no (or very few) direct rubrics, and this
approach seems to work.
Have you looked into a diet that coincides with both your blood type
and your genotype as per Dr Peter D'Adamo. This is often very helpful
in getting over inflammatory responses to food. I also recommend
reading Dr Nicholas Perricone's books on anti-inflammatory diet, and
combining what you find from both sources.
I know this is not a homeopathic remedy idea but I so sympathise with
your situation - I have difficulty finding ways to eat myself, that I
can tolerate - and I used to be unable to take vitamins also due to
the sensitivity you describe. I have improved via homeopathy though
it is in my case an ongoing effort and illness - but I do know how
hard it is to "climb out of the hole" initially, so as to get started
making progress.

Do you have Radar or some such software to look up unusual rubrics in
your case? Also I would strongly suggest you benefit from another
homeopath of your choosing if possible too, as we are SO poor at
being objective about ourselves.
Do you perhaps need to use more generalized rubrics and also perhaps
related issues that match in *principle*. I have had to do this to
find remedies for the cat cases I see. For example I may need to use
"induration" along with "Inflammation, intestines" along with a
general about chronicity ....... rather than one nice rubric.

I doubt I've offered anything really useful here, but thought I'd put
in these "two bits" just in case it might trigger a helpful thought.

Also - on the matter of vitamins. The problem is not the vitamins
but the junk that comes with them in capsules or tablets. If you can
get purified powders it can help, and if you start with the stress
vitamins that help the immune system not to get even more skewed -
that can help: They are ascorbic acid (available as pure crystals,
look for "USP" certified to use as tolerated, start small) , Vit B6
(caps are better than tabs, maybe 100mg a day, but start slow) , and
pantothenic acid (1500 mg a day minimum to get any results, also caps
rather than tabs.) These with Moducare are immune system helpers
either directly (Moducare) or indirectly (by helping the adrenal
system to lower stress levels in the system. Vit E is also great.

I wish you well,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

Dear Elaine,
I havn't heard of it either. But then there are a number of allopathic names I have
not heard of and it doesn't worry me.
We have been taught to not go by names, but to treat the whole person.
Don't disregard that basic tenet.
I would suggest you let a homeopath take your entire case - right from the start,
without putting stress on the present ailment which is a consequence of an earlier
problem.
You are looking at stomach atrophy, without looking for the reason/ cause of it.
I won't be surprised if your basic constitutional remedy is something that in its
rubrics has nothing to do with lymphocytic gastritis.
Jeff Tikari
________________________________

Hi Elaine,

I agree with Pauline and Irene that it's important to do what you can to
find ways to support the vital force while you look for the remedy.

Would you be able to share with us what you have tried so far?

Just to add to Pauline's suggestion.....

--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, "Pauline Ashford "
wrote:
lack of
there
to
aging
Please
... that B12 in a sublingual form can bypass the need for intrinsic
factor in the stomach, and does bring the blood levels up well. Some
people with sensitivities do better on the Methylcobolamin form when it
is injected.

Also, learning how to muscle test for yourself can be a definite time,
money and ordeal saver when you are wondering whether a particular
substance is going to benefit you or cause you problems. It is possible
to self test inconspicuosly when choosing supplements, foods, cleaning
products etc. In this way you can minimize exhausting episodes of
reacting to things that you had hoped would be helpful.

Sorry I don't have more to offer,

Gail.

Hi Elaine-
The suggestions from Pauline look good. Helicobacter nosode is worth
trying.

I have treated a couple of these cases with good results.
Condurango, Hydrastis, Carbo veg ( "Simplest food distresses"),
Carbo animalis, sulphur salts ( Kali.sulph, Strychnine sulph (
gastric atony),Atropin sulph all were considered.

Bismuth, which is good for Helicobater is also a good remedy for
this.
All acids, Phos, Graph etc.

In fact if you read the repertories and materia medica there are
more remedies that can cause this or somethign related- since almost
all medicines in lower potencies will cause some stomach distress.
After all stomach is the first line of defense in all poisons.

Consider the current symptoms. What are the foods that you are
actually unable to tolerate, what foods do you like or would like to
eat...

I would consider this bordering between Psora and Syphilis if you
are inclined to consider these.

Tuberculinum is one consideration ( Abdominal TB could mimic this).

Obviously not all remedies have been pushed to the extent of
creating an atrophic stomach so you would not have an exact mention
in the repertories.
As usual symptoms would guide. Even in nausea, are there ups and
downs, what etc. How is sleep?Any other sensations in the
stomach, abdomen, stools etc. all would be important.

Hydrastis, already mentioned, in low or even mother tincture in drop
doses has a specific mucosal action in the stomach. It is one of the
best to treat even abdominal TB. Read about it in Hering under
Stomach and Nausea.

Stomach, cancer is another rubric that has alot of remedies. Many
of these could be considered for your case.

Give more specific symptoms, some chronology etc. and I could
probably help you. You can write to my personal email in case you
want to do so. rogermassey_homeo at yahoo dot com.
--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, "Pauline Ashford "
wrote:
aging -(
can "affect up to
stomach,
factor. All of
particularly, B12
it can
helicobacter' Ref:
Thomson
is lack of
therefore there
ability to
the aging
is
Please
http://autoimmunedisease.suite101.com/a ... e_atrophic
_gastri
30 remedy
2 patients
helicobacter
constitutional alone
dilutions -
retain
and one tsp
a new
for
give it I
far have had
Behalf Of
and
to a
first
tried a
short
stomach -
was
basis

I know it is not convincing, Symphytum is for broken bones.
But can try it for simple gastritis, it heals gastric tissues & ulcers.
Atrophic being systemic, it may not work here.
No harm trying this clinical tips.
MT sublingual is best.
==========================
rogermassey_homeo wrote: