Minutus

Liz,
We are in total agreement. My comment had to do with the public at large
that can't seem to take in the full impact of what is before their very eyes.
We had a school superintendent in my district who was a total fascist. I
used to tell people that there was something evil about him at a core level.
It took the district 5 yrs to find the proverbial balls to get rid of him. His whole
history, which people in the community investigated, was one of abusing
students and community in order to impose a totalitarian control over the
community. Every job he had he lost for the same reasons but my district
went and hired him and then couldn't get it together to throw him out before
total disaster ensued. It was the same issue--people seeing what was before
them but not really taking it in.
Did you catch Michael Parenti on Alternative Radio 2 days ago? I only heard
a piece of his talk but it was about the core nature of capitalism in opposition
to democratic values and goals. I constantly tell people capitalism simply is the
belief in capital as power and wealth gotten by any means necessary. It is a
system that devalues human life and nature. As such it is antithetical to
democratic and humanistic values. Any effort to 'fix' the system will require a
major overhaul, an upheaval of grand magnitude.
The corporate control of the polity was defined clearly by Mussolini
as the essence of Fascism. Mussolini referred to it as the cooperation between
these 2 institutions. What else do we have in the USA but this corporate control.
And yes, the goal is to take over the world and in the process the effort is to
eliminate some billions of excess people. However, this will be done slowly and
cruelly as the corporate entities will use these people as their economic frontier
using governments to buy billions of dollars of harmful drugs with which to assault
these people. The Bush administration was very successful in its efforts to destroy
many civil liberties, gain control over Iraqi oil, disrupt mid-east stability while inserting
inself soundly in that region, remove unwanted poor people and people of color from
the port of New Orleans in preparation for the developing of the trans-North American
Highway, etc, etc, etc. It just wasn't a great effort for people, but we need to
understand that the Bush administration accomplished a lot of its goal and this
is the legacy that Obama inherited and he is running with the program it seems. the
Codex was signed into effect by Bush, but it was Clinton who promoted the WTO
which was part of the ground work for Codex. Weren't we short-sighted at the time.
Well, bringing my rant back to focus on homeopathy and healing, we are here today
struggling for our survival within a hostile economic environment that has every
indication of wanting total control over our bodies for purposes not to our benefit.
So we are attacked heavily by the FDA here and in Britain there is a mass media
campaign to destroy homeopathy despite its very long and commendable history in
that nation.
tanya

Hi Liz and Theresa,

I can't help but feel uneasy and concerned about discussions like this taking place in a forum that is well known for being infiltrated by trolls known to be associated to the likes of David Colquhoun and Simon Singh. Best wishes, Grace

Boy are we in synch. My belief is that the deal was cut prior to the election
when he went to the white house to discuss the $700 billion welfare to Wall
St and the banks. I do think we was read the riot act against any regulations
for the financial and corporate sectors and probably told, or had it implied,
that he would not survive if he tried to apply any controls. His behavior
in office has put the lie to almost everything important to the public that he
promised. I cry now for the betrayal of the people but try to keep strong
in my efforts. We have to look to the power in numbers in the public and that
is a daunting effort but the only one that will give us any of what we need.
I think that O gave the public that admonition during his campaign when he
spoke about the people keeping his toes to the fire. He had to have known
that he could not do any major change without a super ground swell from
the population. And yes, it is a serious fight. Just look at the organization
with the media's complicity against Single Payer and even the benign
Public Option in health care changes.
tanya

Hi Grace,
do you mean discussion of pc remedies (on a website already), reference to clinics and projects (that have websites and newsletters) or the political 'rants' - or is it the general discussion of homeopathy and aids that you think will attract the trolls? Many of the discussions that we have had recently might have pleased our critics ..... I don't think we can run scared all the time! Personally I would rather pc remedies and homeopathy weren't discussed together at all for similar reasons but that is a controversial view in itself, it seems, and the newsgroup is for us to use for discusssion.
Theresa
--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, "bty17859616" wrote:

i have been talking about the Codex for at least 6 yrs now. that group
has been meeting for quite a few yrs--many more than 6. i understand
they have 14 committees and thousands of pages of minute notes.
all of them designed to give total control of health and food over to the
corporate elite. monsanto and their ilk get food to poison us by. big
pharma gets to force drugs on us when we sicken from toxic food. then
there is the poisoned environment with all the industrial and factory poisons,
human and animal waste being dumped into the water ways and land which
will ensure increasing complications in the kinds of diseases that afflict
people. destroyed immune systems will further ensure a weakened population
while minds are eaten up by the toxins of vaccines, mercury in water, flouride
and chlorine in our drinking and bathing water, toothpastes and other body
soaps and lotions. the list is astronomical.
so what will homeopaths do to ensure that we are not eaten alive, quite
literally by this ongoing and increasing assault on our health and environment?
some think we should not be political on this list. however, what is happening
in gb and the usa is happening all over the world and absolutely affects our
future and ability to function in a meaningful healing profession. if we have
no access to the remedies and/or are declared illegal then where do we go?
tanya

No Theresa, I was referring to this piece:

"You mention talks with the governments in Botswana, Ghana and Tanzania about homeopathic clinics - I didn't know about these, and it's great to hear that this is going on".......

which in my opinion does not appear on our website, as well as other activities that we are currently pursuing.

Grace

--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, "tg.partington" wrote:

Well, Grace, it was in the widely-distributed newsletter and which is itself available online - and newsletters themselves aren't the best place to keep secrets, I would have thought!! I was sure I'd seen it on the project website, too, but you are right that it is not on the revamped one (which is excellent, by the way).
I think in an environment where homeopathy is being accused of working in an unprofessional 'wildcat' manner overseas it is important to put the record straight where possible - and not to get too paranoid.
Theresa
--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, "bty17859616" wrote:

Actually, I think there has been a fair amount of treatment of HIV/AIDS in the West using normal homeopathic protocols (I know, for example, Vega Rosenberg has been treating such patients since the late 80s/early 90s) but I haven't heard much in the way of success stories, although it's also true to say that it is an offence to make claims to be able to cure AIDS, so maybe it has to be very low-key.
The concern about providing treatment for AIDS in Africa has only really come about in the last ten years or so, after the epidemic in AIDs cases which eventually got into the media. Peter Chappell has been trying to find something which works more effectively than our usual remedies - and he cared enough to go out to Africa, before it was fashionable, before conventional medicine was made more widely available, in order to try and help with the suffering there. My understanding is that he developed the remedies he uses over there, after observing and analysing his observations and realising that a change was needed. I don't know how easy it would have been to do that over here anyway; most HIV/AIDS patients are on conventional meds, aren't they? To find a genus epidemicus, you need a lot of cases to compare.
What Peter has done is exactly what Hahnemann did! He observed that medicine wasn't working, and found alternatives. I don't see how you can criticise Peter for that. And as for presenting homeopathy - any kind of homeopathy! - to the authorities as an established therapy, well, dream on! They won't listen to any alternative, however long it has been used, however we present it. Good old polychrests or new-fangled PC remedies - it's all mumbo-jumbo to them.
Peter has gone out on a limb - he deserves support, in my opinion. And protecting his remedies is only fair - look at what has happened to the Soham foundation, who also need funds to continue their work. Their Narayani remedies have been copied and spread around to others' profit!
Liz

Hi Theresa
Thanks for getting back! Lots to think about!
My impression was that traditional homeopathy wasn't working - that's why PC decided to think outside the box, so to speak. But as I said, it would have to be low-key, so maybe some clinics have had success. You probably know more than me.
As for the use of allopathic drugs because they are available OTC - I honestly think that most really poor Africans don't even have the money for that - in the bush, they can go for months without seeing a doctor. let alone a chemist's shop!
You mention talks with the governments in Botswana, Ghana and Tanzania about homeopathic clinics - I didn't know about these, and it's great to hear that this is going on. Nevertheless, I'm sure that any allopathic 'help' from the drug companies would be probably be made conditional upon the rejection of alternative possibilities, so how firm those discussions will turn out to be remains to be seen once there is the possibility or any help from outside agencies )there was an awful lot of pressure placed upon Mbeki in South Africa, for example)
Lastly, you said " I don't think prescribing blind is the answer!"
- what did you mean exactly?

Liz

It wasn't that simple. There was a long hard fight in South Africa - does anyone remember the articles in the Sunday Times about this some years back? The Times (strangely, because they usually toe the allopathic line on all things medical)initially took the view that the HIV virus had never actually been seen under a microscope, and that there was therefore something else going on, But it was attacked for its stance on this, and subsequently went silent. And Mbeki, who argued long and hard against anti-viral drugs, taking advice from independent scientists who wanted to promote vitamins and better nutrition, was finally silenced - and the drug companies won! Mbeki is now no longer President.
Liz