Minutus

With some, I certainly do; with others, not.

I guess...
So *what* do you agree with--do you or don't you (still) agree that
hygiene and sterile technique are useful and even lifesaving in certain
conditions? Is the "pathogens don't matter" argument meant to apply
only to specific diseases, or are you making that as a general
assertion?
Shannon

Hi Sheri,
No you haven't. I've asked directly--do you (still) believe that
*some* microbes are responsible for *some* problems (infection,
disease, etc.), and you have not answered. Without a direct answer to
that direct question, we are lost in a Wonderland sort of ill-defined
non-discussion. So, unless you are willing to give me a direct answer
to that direct question, I am out of this discussion.
Best wishes,
Shannon
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From a homeopathic point of view we are not lost at all - NO-ONE can
say for sure what purpose 'microbes' have in the broad outlook of
disease, but does it matter? If you have a serious acute condition of,
for example, persistent diarrhoea and vomiting are you going to waste
time debating the role of microbes or are you going to concentrate on
location, sensation, extension, modalities, concommitants or are you
going to take the allopathic route and only address the alleged
germicidal causation?

We might all harbour an amazing range of so called microbes but as
homeopaths we are more likely to place a great deal of importance onto
the exciting cause/reason for those potential microbes that might
penetrate our levels of survival than the doubtful pernicious
intentions of the said microbes. To blame the microbes is the same as
negating the whole notion of the 'individual' and its vital force. The
microbes might be present but the exciting cause could be shock, chill,
over exertion, grief, abuse etc etc - the basics of homeopathic
practice. Joy

http://www.homeopathicmateriamedica.com
http://www.homeopathicmateriamedica.blogspot.com
http://homepage.mac.com/joylucas/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/provings

Hi Joy and Sheri,
The one difference that I am concerned about, is that if we "don't
believe in pathogens" then the standard protective measures won't be
followed--sterile methods, isolation/avoidance of patients with a
severe "communicable" disease, removal or avoidance of reservoirs of
infection--vaccinations and antibiotics don't have to be anywhere near
the picture for it to make a *great* deal of difference.

Below:
Yes it matters, to those who might be vulnerable, because it gives them
a choice to take protective measures. (Wash hands; hang mosquito
netting; clean dirty wounds; avoid sharing cups etc.; avoid infected
people, etc., etc.)

Joy--since Sheri seems unwilling to answer, maybe you would like to
give your opinion? Do you or do you not agree that the above
measures--mosquito netting, cleaning dirty wounds, sterile instruments
for surgery, etc.--are useful in reducing bad reactions to injuries,
surgery, mosquito-laden areas, etc.?
That's very like saying that if a pedophile grabs your kid it's not his
fault, because he couldn't have gotten him/her unless s/he'd been
vulnerable. So do we pretend there are no pedophiles, and when they
grab a kid don't worry, 'cause it wasn't the guy's fault anyway?

Shannon

Bugs and bacteria exist and it is part of the survival chain - the
weakest link and survival of the fittest. Humans will always have
something to fight against in the struggle for power over .....
(whatever it is). When these 'measures' are in place it doesn't seem to
be making that much of a difference. What does clean water mean?
Fluoride laden, bugs that are totally resistant to the induced
'measure'. Who knows. Quality of life, yes. It has to be the best for
everyone but it is not a standstill moment, it is forever evolving and
one 'bug' gets replaced by another. What is a sterile instrument? How
do we know someone will be susceptible to a mosquito bite - is it the
mosquito or the person. The real answer would be found if Homeopathy
was widespread and excellently practiced everywhere and where the
susceptibilities could be treated/cured (a world we don't know about) -
otherwise it is conjecture. But then what will happen to all the
mosquitos - survival of the fittest. Don't care for the paedophile
analogy and brining in a 'not caring' and 'pretending it isn't there'
argument (no-one has said that and is quite offensive) - but how does a
paedophile get to be such? Cause and effect is a mighty topic to be
discussing. Joy

http://www.homeopathicmateriamedica.com
http://www.homeopathicmateriamedica.blogspot.com
http://homepage.mac.com/joylucas/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/provings

The discussion is moving at cross-purposes, so I'll go back to other
things. (Again, sigh...)
Best wishes, and stay out of swamps!

Shannon
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Or very small aliens in their highly toxic spaceships? Sheri,
you're being silly...
It's true that he did not know the specifics of the thing he talked
about. (I forget whether Leew... the first microscope guy... was
before or after his time. But sub-atomic particles or packets of
energy? Sigh, this "discussion" gets weirder and weirder...
Shannon

Thanks Sheri,
That's clearly stated! More so than what I'd gotten before.
I still don't understand how you apply that reasoning to so many common
scenarios, but it seems that neither of us is really hearing the other,
so I will let it go for the time being. Thanks for trying.
Shannon
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So what explanation for disease do you propose?
You've sent posts that suggest various possibilities--in fact just
about everything *except* "microbes". What do *you* think is the cause
of "disease"--and if you think, as I do, that there are various causes,
could you list those possible causes you *do* find plausible?
Thanks,
Shannon
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