Spayed bitch lactating with possible vaccinnosis???

[sheleenhamilton]

Can you advise/help?

I have a soon to be 6 year old patterdale/lakeland terrier cross. She seems to have an obsession with any kind of dragging, brushing or running water she goes into a trance and is obsessed. It isnt really a big problem because she does stop when you scold her.

Right now she is lactating. The vet and internet say that this isnt a big problem. The bottom nipples nearest to her tail end are the most swollen because she has been constantly licking these two. Intense heat every night with sleeplessness. I was shocked because I didnt think that this could happen after spaying? She was spayed in 2008 I cant remember how old but between 12-14 months old. Not eating for a few days now. Whiney. Sighing a lot. She is hot at night. I have noticed her shivering in the morning afternoon and night the last couple of days. I can feel a lump near the spay operation scar. Im thinking that the vet has left a stitch inside which doesnt seem to bother Millie. I took her to the vet who said it wasnt serious - False pregnancy - and to give her 1ml Bromocriptine 2.5mg diluted in 25 mls of water day and night for 10 days and then to reduce the dose to .05ml day and night for a further 7 days. She started a few years ago wanting you to tickle touch rub her belly every evening and then went into demanding this by kicking you and moaning. This problem has been going on for years I think. It just hasnt ever been this bad before. So she could have been lactating in previous years it just wasnt noticeable. So is this related to the timing of her spaying?

I repertorised before going to the vet and before realising there was milk. I thought it was possibly an abscess. In a panic I gave her Phosphorous because I went on the totality of the symptoms and Phosphorous was the match. After giving her Phosphorous she had a good sleep without much restlessness. After seeing the vet I gave her the Bromocriptine and she had another less restless night. However, last night she was still slightly agitated and hot. I have repertorised again Puls was coming up. I dont want to give her anything else because this is chronic and needs a Homeopath to deal with it. Im waiting to see if she will take us on.

I was also thinking about what I learnt in a recent course

It is important to remember what Kent said in his Lectures on Homeopathic Philosophy:
"It is important to avoid getting confused by two disease images that may exist in the body at the same time. A chronic patient, for instance, may be suffering from an acute disease and the physician on being called may think that it is necessary to take the totality of the symptoms; but if he should do that in an acute disease, mixing both CHRONIC and ACUTE symptoms together, he will become confused and will not find the right remedy." (emphasis added).

Also when Ruby my doberman would do these awful aggressive attacks on Dante (a recent rescue), Mille would come rushing over to join in the attack with Ruby. Millie has always been a fussy eater. Usually prefers to eat late in the evening. She does eat during the day but I think she prefers to eat later. She really isnt keen on raw food either. She gets jealous if we show affection to the other dogs. Before Ruby died Millie would go upstairs every evening at 8pm to nap on my bed. Since Ruby died she is spending more time downstairs with the rest of us in the evenings. I noticed her throwing herself down on the floor one day and letting out a loud sigh. She does seem worse at night.
She really loves the sun so much so that her pink underbelly is now covered in black patches of pigmentation. She hates cats.

I know Im out of my league with this any help will be greatly appreciated.
Sheleen

[Ginny Wilken]

Sheleen, I'm not a "real" homeopath. But I have experience with the many manifestations of vaccinosis, as well as with bitches. I will say only that I believe you have correctly identified vaccine damage as shown by the water fascination among other things. Of course, it really doesn't matter the cause, but only the symptoms, and I would not advise any sort of knee-jerk prescribing of Thuja or Lyssin, but would find an excellent and experienced homeopath to fully take the case. That said, Pulsatilla has a really good record with problems of estrus, including false pregnancy symptoms, and even if her spayed condition makes this whole thing part of chronic disease, the acute symptoms can certainly be addressed as that. So, I'd try Puls, in one or two very conservative doses, and watch and wait. I surely would NOT be using any drug on her, especially with her obvious chronic disease. An early spay can cause all sorts of hormonal havoc later, even though most folks would not call this early. I believe, in any case, in leaving dogs intact, since it will always be healthier for them, and the common fears about pyo, mammary cancer, aggression, etc. fail to identify these as all signs of ill health, not of being natural.

But that's all just my experience, not certifiably authoritative:)

ginny

All stunts performed without a net!

[Sheleen Hamilton]

Thanks Ginny
One or two conservative doses? Should I try Puls 30c diluted in water 10 taps 1 teaspoon - is this what you mean by conservative? Maybe repeat it after one week if necessary? Can you elaborate on the vaccinosis - have you seen recovery from this? I'd love to read some success stories and I mean actual cases were I can see the homeopathy remedies prescribed and evidence of them working, the unravelling so to speak. I havent seen any actual case studies that actually show the remedy working. So when I start the Pulsatilla I can stop the medicine from the vet - Bromcriptine?
Sorry that I have bombarded you with all of these extra questions. As I said I am waiting to hear from my Homeopath but I think she is overworked as her last email said she didnt have time for an emergency right now. So you can imagine Im panicing having recently lost my doberman at age 5.
Why arent there more success stories out there? BTW I have been reading these forums for some time now. Thanks to all for sharing and helping me to get my head around a lot of stuff!
Thank you very much
Regards
Sheleen

________________________________

From: ginny wilken
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 8 November 2012, 3:21
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Spayed bitch lactating with possible vaccinnosis???
Sheleen, I'm not a "real" homeopath. But I have experience with the many manifestations of vaccinosis, as well as with bitches. I will say only that I believe you have correctly identified vaccine damage as shown by the water fascination among other things. Of course, it really doesn't matter the cause, but only the symptoms, and I would not advise any sort of knee-jerk prescribing of Thuja or Lyssin, but would find an excellent and experienced homeopath to fully take the case. That said, Pulsatilla has a really good record with problems of estrus, including false pregnancy symptoms, and even if her spayed condition makes this whole thing part of chronic disease, the acute symptoms can certainly be addressed as that. So, I'd try Puls, in one or two very conservative doses, and watch and wait. I surely would NOT be using any drug on her, especially with her obvious chronic disease. An early spay can cause all sorts of hormonal havoc later, even though most folks would not call this early. I believe, in any case, in leaving dogs intact, since it will always be healthier for them, and the common fears about pyo, mammary cancer, aggression, etc. fail to identify these as all signs of ill health, not of being natural.

But that's all just my experience, not certifiably authoritative:)

ginny

All stunts performed without a net!

[Sheleen Hamilton]

Hi Ginny
I gave her the Puls 10 taps 1 teaspoon at midday today. It was all going well until just now and she is having these tremors/shakes like a muscle spasm. ???? They dont last long but Im worried. Initially I thought it was periodic cold episodes like shivering being cold but now I think it isnt that at all. She ate some chicken this evening. The heat is reduced around her lower nipple area. The restlessness at night has improved dramatically. So she had 10 taps 1 teaspoon of Phos on Monday. This was before I was informed by the vet it was indeed a false pregnancy. I had repertorised and thought it was an abcess. What are your thoughts? Oh also I have noticed a tiny spot by her lowest left nipple. Like a tiny wart or it could be a blister. It is white. She also has brown pigmentation on her belly/chest from sunbathing a lot. She has the marks on her back and you can see them better when she is having a bath. Am I over stressing?
Sheleen
________________________________

From: ginny wilken
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 8 November 2012, 3:21
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Spayed bitch lactating with possible vaccinnosis???
Sheleen, I'm not a "real" homeopath. But I have experience with the many manifestations of vaccinosis, as well as with bitches. I will say only that I believe you have correctly identified vaccine damage as shown by the water fascination among other things. Of course, it really doesn't matter the cause, but only the symptoms, and I would not advise any sort of knee-jerk prescribing of Thuja or Lyssin, but would find an excellent and experienced homeopath to fully take the case. That said, Pulsatilla has a really good record with problems of estrus, including false pregnancy symptoms, and even if her spayed condition makes this whole thing part of chronic disease, the acute symptoms can certainly be addressed as that. So, I'd try Puls, in one or two very conservative doses, and watch and wait. I surely would NOT be using any drug on her, especially with her obvious chronic disease. An early spay can cause all sorts of hormonal havoc later, even though most folks would not call this early. I believe, in any case, in leaving dogs intact, since it will always be healthier for them, and the common fears about pyo, mammary cancer, aggression, etc. fail to identify these as all signs of ill health, not of being natural.

But that's all just my experience, not certifiably authoritative:)

ginny

All stunts performed without a net!

[Ginny Wilken]

Maybe:)

Well, it sounds as if there was a remedy result from the Phos that might have been going on still. This isn't bad, but it makes the result unclear. Were it I, I would watch and wait before redosing the Puls, to be more sure of what one is seeing. And please do discontinue the drug, as her system will be confused by the suppression caused by the drug. Maybe it IS time for that deep breath, and a wait of some days - or, better, hooking up with a practitioner.

I consider the Puls as an acute remedy for the false pregnancy symptoms, not necessarily for chronic disease, for which I do not venture to dose or prescribe without the concurrence of my homeopath, and certainly not to advise others. I can certainly guide you to an excellent veterinary homeopath who can clearly see the issues.

I don't think the pigmentation is from the sun; brown or reddish spots and blotches figure highly in skin issues from vaccines, too. There are undoubtedly other symptoms, many of which often go unrecognized by those not familiar with the typical repertory of vaccine damage.

To address your earlier post, I have observed and even managed many chronic cases where vaccine damage is the main culprit. I have seen behavior change overnight, skin heal, digestion improve, musculo-skeletal issues improve, conditions like megaesophagus and ataxia improve, seizures and other ictal behaviors diminish, compulsions vanish, and a whole raft of other nice results. Where pathology has not set in, the animal can be seemingly completely healed. And even some pathological outcomes, where disease symptoms have injured systems and organs, can be managed and improved vastly. Of course, as with humans, any acute issues that arise at any point in life can also be addressed as they come.

I don't know of too many collected case histories in animals, but this is homeopathy, after all, and we can expect anything that we would expect in human cases - and more, since often there is not the inherited miasmatic complexity that most humans carry within.

I hope this is helpful. Please tell us how she is doing.

ginny
All stunts performed without a net!

[Sheleen Hamilton]

Hi
Yes, I agree. I think I have to wait and see now. Her appetite was great last night. She seems good this morning:) but she is worse at night so let's see what she is like over the next few days. Im still waiting to see if the Homeopath can take her on. I will keep you updated on her progress.
Thanks again.
Sheleen

________________________________

From: ginny wilken
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 8 November 2012, 22:28
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Spayed bitch lactating with possible vaccinnosis???
Maybe:)

Well, it sounds as if there was a remedy result from the Phos that might have been going on still. This isn't bad, but it makes the result unclear. Were it I, I would watch and wait before redosing the Puls, to be more sure of what one is seeing. And please do discontinue the drug, as her system will be confused by the suppression caused by the drug. Maybe it IS time for that deep breath, and a wait of some days - or, better, hooking up with a practitioner.

I consider the Puls as an acute remedy for the false pregnancy symptoms, not necessarily for chronic disease, for which I do not venture to dose or prescribe without the concurrence of my homeopath, and certainly not to advise others. I can certainly guide you to an excellent veterinary homeopath who can clearly see the issues.

I don't think the pigmentation is from the sun; brown or reddish spots and blotches figure highly in skin issues from vaccines, too. There are undoubtedly other symptoms, many of which often go unrecognized by those not familiar with the typical repertory of vaccine damage.

To address your earlier post, I have observed and even managed many chronic cases where vaccine damage is the main culprit. I have seen behavior change overnight, skin heal, digestion improve, musculo-skeletal issues improve, conditions like megaesophagus and ataxia improve, seizures and other ictal behaviors diminish, compulsions vanish, and a whole raft of other nice results. Where pathology has not set in, the animal can be seemingly completely healed. And even some pathological outcomes, where disease symptoms have injured systems and organs, can be managed and improved vastly. Of course, as with humans, any acute issues that arise at any point in life can also be addressed as they come.

I don't know of too many collected case histories in animals, but this is homeopathy, after all, and we can expect anything that we would expect in human cases - and more, since often there is not the inherited miasmatic complexity that most humans carry within.

I hope this is helpful. Please tell us how she is doing.

ginny
All stunts performed without a net!

[Sheleen Hamilton]

Hello all I would be grateful for any advice. Many thanks in advance:)

My dog has been spayed many years ago. She was about 14 months old. I had to get her sterilised as at that time she was a brilliant escape artist. Currently she is 6 years old. She is lactating, nesting, crying, wanting belly rubbed, off her food. She is keen to mate with the male dogs (sterilised) and then goes through this phantom pregnancy on a regular basis now. Someone told me the other day that this is normal for a bitch to do this. How come all our other female spayed dogs have never done this over the years!!! So I don't believe this is normal behaviour.
I took her to the vet who prescribed Bromocriptine 2.5mg. It worked. However I really wanted to do her treatment using Homeopathy. I have tried Pulsatilla but I only have 30c. It isnt working. I am about to give her the Bromocriptine again. I have been trying the Puls for few days now but it obviously hasnt worked.
Before you all suggest a Homeopath. I have already paid out a fortune from my savings (now depleted). I did ask a well known US Homeopath who was highly recommended by a friend (This Homeopath treats Humans and Animals)several years ago to help me with this problem and after paying fees for several dogs and members of my family to be under her care, she dumped us all with some USA new regulation poppycock. I was furious with this person because they were quick to take the fees and within days we were dropped like hot cakes. Yes this person took on new cases and within one week we were all dumped, my mother, myself and three dogs. IMO a disgrace to the profession. The polite and gracious thing would have been to inform me of her future intentions.
Not only that but I was keen to learn from "Yoda" (no disrespect meant here) but I never got a coherent response to any question, no feedback, nothing so I was so gutted to say the least. I just got ranting screaming emails shouting at the stupidity of my questions. I was a student of Homeopathy and still am. So I learnt the hard way. Luckily it hasnt put me off Homeopathy in fact it has had the opposite effect. I didnt really appreciate the excuse that this Homeopath had 300 open cases. I dont care, just provide the service that I paid for!!!! Obviously 300 open cases is too much for this Homeopath to deal with hence the screaming emails.
In addition, I had a doberman with aggression problems towards my other dogs and who was under the care of this Homeopath. Unfortunately my dobie died last year whilst I was abroad helping out my parents. Just awful she was only 5. 99.9% of the time the most amazing dog. I miss her so much This dog was not spayed because of the problems our other dog had. So when her season wasnt ending we were advised by the Homeopath that it could be Pyometra. When the vet did the spay he found a tumor, she went home and was fine. Next day she died after several seizures. I had called the Homeopath who hung up on me. Saying, call only in emergencies. Im not saying this was the Homeopath's fault but I had to go abroad and do the reports about the dog via my partner. This Homeopath refused to continue the treatment, after the payment of course. That was such a kick in the teeth.
Since then I have found this wonderful forum - I love it. Im sorry about my rant above just needed to get it off my chest.
---In minutus@yahoogroups.com, wrote:
Hi Ginny
I gave her the Puls 10 taps 1 teaspoon at midday today. It was all going well until just now and she is having these tremors/shakes like a muscle spasm. ???? They dont last long but Im worried. Initially I thought it was periodic cold episodes like shivering being cold but now I think it isnt that at all. She ate some chicken this evening. The heat is reduced around her lower nipple area. The restlessness at night has improved dramatically. So she had 10 taps 1 teaspoon of Phos on Monday. This was before I was informed by the vet it was indeed a false pregnancy. I had repertorised and thought it was an abcess. What are your thoughts? Oh also I have noticed a tiny spot by her lowest left nipple. Like a tiny wart or it could be a blister. It is white. She also has brown pigmentation on her belly/chest from sunbathing a lot. She has the marks on her back and you can see them better when she is having a bath. Am I over stressing?
Sheleen
________________________________

From: ginny wilken
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 8 November 2012, 3:21
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Spayed bitch lactating with possible vaccinnosis???
Sheleen, I'm not a "real" homeopath. But I have experience with the many manifestations of vaccinosis, as well as with bitches. I will say only that I believe you have correctly identified vaccine damage as shown by the water fascination among other things. Of course, it really doesn't matter the cause, but only the symptoms, and I would not advise any sort of knee-jerk prescribing of Thuja or Lyssin, but would find an excellent and experienced homeopath to fully take the case. That said, Pulsatilla has a really good record with problems of estrus, including false pregnancy symptoms, and even if her spayed condition makes this whole thing part of chronic disease, the acute symptoms can certainly be addressed as that. So, I'd try Puls, in one or two very conservative doses, and watch and wait. I surely would NOT be using any drug on her, especially with her obvious chronic disease. An early spay can cause all sorts of hormonal havoc later, even though most folks would not call this early. I believe, in any case, in leaving dogs intact, since it will always be healthier for them, and the common fears about pyo, mammary cancer, aggression, etc. fail to identify these as all signs of ill health, not of being natural.

But that's all just my experience, not certifiably authoritative:)

ginny

All stunts performed without a net!

[Sheleen Hamilton]

It's me again, I just found this quite useful website and thought you might like to see it too...

http://www.naturalrearing.com/coda/p_ho ... l_rem.html

I forgot to mention that my dog is also having shudder episodes at different times of the day. Please excuse my ignorance but I haven't experience with breeding dogs, nor do I know what the milk flow should be like. I have read up the remedies for MIND: False pregnancy but they dont mention the milk production, should I be looking at the remedies for the production of milk and her discomfort instead.

I have info overload.
---In minutus@yahoogroups.com, wrote:
Hello all I would be grateful for any advice. Many thanks in advance:)

My dog has been spayed many years ago. She was about 14 months old. I had to get her sterilised as at that time she was a brilliant escape artist. Currently she is 6 years old. She is lactating, nesting, crying, wanting belly rubbed, off her food. She is keen to mate with the male dogs (sterilised) and then goes through this phantom pregnancy on a regular basis now. Someone told me the other day that this is normal for a bitch to do this. How come all our other female spayed dogs have never done this over the years!!! So I don't believe this is normal behaviour.
I took her to the vet who prescribed Bromocriptine 2.5mg. It worked. However I really wanted to do her treatment using Homeopathy. I have tried Pulsatilla but I only have 30c. It isnt working. I am about to give her the Bromocriptine again. I have been trying the Puls for few days now but it obviously hasnt worked.
Before you all suggest a Homeopath. I have already paid out a fortune from my savings (now depleted). I did ask a well known US Homeopath who was highly recommended by a friend (This Homeopath treats Humans and Animals)several years ago to help me with this problem and after paying fees for several dogs and members of my family to be under her care, she dumped us all with some USA new regulation poppycock. I was furious with this person because they were quick to take the fees and within days we were dropped like hot cakes. Yes this person took on new cases and within one week we were all dumped, my mother, myself and three dogs. IMO a disgrace to the profession. The polite and gracious thing would have been to inform me of her future intentions.
Not only that but I was keen to learn from "Yoda" (no disrespect meant here) but I never got a coherent response to any question, no feedback, nothing so I was so gutted to say the least. I just got ranting screaming emails shouting at the stupidity of my questions. I was a student of Homeopathy and still am. So I learnt the hard way. Luckily it hasnt put me off Homeopathy in fact it has had the opposite effect. I didnt really appreciate the excuse that this Homeopath had 300 open cases. I dont care, just provide the service that I paid for!!!! Obviously 300 open cases is too much for this Homeopath to deal with hence the screaming emails.
In addition, I had a doberman with aggression problems towards my other dogs and who was under the care of this Homeopath. Unfortunately my dobie died last year whilst I was abroad helping out my parents. Just awful she was only 5. 99.9% of the time the most amazing dog. I miss her so much This dog was not spayed because of the problems our other dog had. So when her season wasnt ending we were advised by the Homeopath that it could be Pyometra. When the vet did the spay he found a tumor, she went home and was fine. Next day she died after several seizures. I had called the Homeopath who hung up on me. Saying, call only in emergencies. Im not saying this was the Homeopath's fault but I had to go abroad and do the reports about the dog via my partner. This Homeopath refused to continue the treatment, after the payment of course. That was such a kick in the teeth.
Since then I have found this wonderful forum - I love it. Im sorry about my rant above just needed to get it off my chest.
---In minutus@yahoogroups.com, wrote:
Hi Ginny
I gave her the Puls 10 taps 1 teaspoon at midday today. It was all going well until just now and she is having these tremors/shakes like a muscle spasm. ???? They dont last long but Im worried. Initially I thought it was periodic cold episodes like shivering being cold but now I think it isnt that at all. She ate some chicken this evening. The heat is reduced around her lower nipple area. The restlessness at night has improved dramatically. So she had 10 taps 1 teaspoon of Phos on Monday. This was before I was informed by the vet it was indeed a false pregnancy. I had repertorised and thought it was an abcess. What are your thoughts? Oh also I have noticed a tiny spot by her lowest left nipple. Like a tiny wart or it could be a blister. It is white. She also has brown pigmentation on her belly/chest from sunbathing a lot. She has the marks on her back and you can see them better when she is having a bath. Am I over stressing?
Sheleen
________________________________

From: ginny wilken
To: minutus@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 8 November 2012, 3:21
Subject: Re: [Minutus] Spayed bitch lactating with possible vaccinnosis???
Sheleen, I'm not a "real" homeopath. But I have experience with the many manifestations of vaccinosis, as well as with bitches. I will say only that I believe you have correctly identified vaccine damage as shown by the water fascination among other things. Of course, it really doesn't matter the cause, but only the symptoms, and I would not advise any sort of knee-jerk prescribing of Thuja or Lyssin, but would find an excellent and experienced homeopath to fully take the case. That said, Pulsatilla has a really good record with problems of estrus, including false pregnancy symptoms, and even if her spayed condition makes this whole thing part of chronic disease, the acute symptoms can certainly be addressed as that. So, I'd try Puls, in one or two very conservative doses, and watch and wait. I surely would NOT be using any drug on her, especially with her obvious chronic disease. An early spay can cause all sorts of hormonal havoc later, even though most folks would not call this early. I believe, in any case, in leaving dogs intact, since it will always be healthier for them, and the common fears about pyo, mammary cancer, aggression, etc. fail to identify these as all signs of ill health, not of being natural.

But that's all just my experience, not certifiably authoritative:)

ginny

All stunts performed without a net!

[Ginny Wilken]

Sheleen,

I find it ironic that this site purports to be for "those who think for themselves", since that is exactly the opposite of what they offer. Homeopathy, especially Hahnemannian homeopathy, is never prescribed on a "this for that" basis, but rather only after consideration of the entire presentation of the case. Classical homeopathy also does not include combination remedies of any kind, as they cloud a case and can cause unwanted or dangerous effects not part of the case.

Although first aid knowledge is a handy thing, any use of this shotgun approach, I feel, would be shortchanging your dog and stressing her unnecessarily. This is a chronic disease situation and she needs a qualified practitioner familiar with dogs, and especially dogs' hormonal cycles. Don't waste your money further.
ginny

All stunts performed without a net!

[John R. Benneth]

Sheleen . .
Pulsatilla is the primary remedy for non pregnant lactation. Secondary remedies are Asaf., Cycl., Merc., Tub., Urt-u. Tertiary remedies are Ars., Bell., Bor., Lyc., Phos., Lyc.
Shuddering is also Pulsatilla, Rhus- tox and Bell.
The neediness makes it definitely sound like Pulsatilla. Try a lower potency in X.
John
In a message dated 9/26/2013 3:27:01 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, sheleenhamilton@yahoo.co.uk writes:
________________________________
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