Becky - vet question

[talkforum]

BEcky, we often have to give remedies to animals in food and usually they
work fine. When giving a 200c or 1 M and waiting a month to re-evaluate it
is better, since if nothing happens in a month you are left with the question
if it was the foood or your prescribing? Food - of course, never your
prescribiing - right? No, really we often treat feral cats and dogs and
could never give the remedy "properly". If an animal will drink milk or eat
a bland dairy product, that is better than food.

I agree with Jill - remedies work through drugs. Paul Herscu had a case of a
woman in an institution - gave 200c daily because all the meds she was on
(lithium and other heavy duty drugs), but he got a wonderful response and
they were able to decrease her meds.

Becky, what is the name of the vet doing a "little" homeopathy? Maybe we can
get her to take the NCH animal homeopathy summer school (2 + 4 days), or The
Professional course organized by Dr. Pitcairn (1 yr)

Also, if anyone needs help finding a vet who does homeopathy, go to
www.theAVH.org. If you have clients who ask and would like to talk with a
holsitic vet to decide who to work with (personal referral), call
866-4-VET-NOW for the veterinary advice line. $35 to have animal's problem
reviewed and options discussed and a referral made.

Christina Chambreau
HealthyAnimals@aol.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Dave Hartley]

I received an unsolicited comment on Pitcairn's courses from someone
I've come to respect in terms of a growing depth of homeopathic
understanding:

" ... Pitcairn is a pseudo-homeopath that is producing a bunch of
"cookbook" style practitioners. I KNOW. I studied with him and end up
with the cases that a vet he teaches screw up royally! Thank you!"

I'd urge people who're thinking of taking any such courses to be aware
of possible bias toward routinism.
Dave Hartley
www.localcomputermart.com/dave
Santa Cruz, CA (831)464-8127

[becklesfield]

Hi Christine

If I'm using a higher potency I normally administer the remedy to
this cat in cream, but as 6c was the only potency I could find at
short notice I felt more comfortable pinning him down 'as it were'
instead of giving him cream more than twice a day. However I
unfortunately didn't have any cream on the premises either!



I agree with Dave; I've also been told by someone I respect that
Pitcairn is turning out homeopathic vets that are underparr,
prescribe using mechanical re-dosing and are not doing a good job at
all.

I've already been through two homeopathic vets here in the UK both of
which I decided not to use because I didn't agree with their
technique, which sounds very similar to what Pitcairn is teaching.

The first did very well with my female but aggravated my male badly
and bascially abandoned us to our fate when I refused to re-dose him
on the 1M potency that he'd aggravated on in the first place. I then
tried someone else who was so arrogant he refused to answer any of my
emails questioning him on his practice style so that I could
ascertain whether or not I wanted to use him in the first place. I
am a beginner in prescribing homeopathy myself but have had to learn
fast how to choose a good practitioner. This guy particularly felt
that LM potencies *must* be given mechanically every day for 10 days
in order to work, which is clearly wrong.

In any case, I would be more weary and fearful of using an allopathic
vet who had taken a short course in homeopathy than allowing them to
use allopathic medicine, which at least they've studied for 7 years.

I've had my fingers burnt twice now and I presently use a layperson
who I do trust to know what she's doing.

Take care
Becky

[Marleen]

Hi Becky,

I agree with you and been true the same experience myself not in UK
but in Belgium, very few homeopathic vets here, the one i had
prescribed a remedy after looking at my dog 2 or 3 minutes and asked a
few questions, then prescribed a 200K, i have used him 4 times in a
row for the same dog and every time he was only 3 minutes with my dog
and every time prescribed a 200K. It was a regular vet that did a
course in homeopathy. My friend used the same vet for her horse and
again he prescribed a 200K.

I was already very interested in homeopathy before i used that vet,
i could not find an other one near by, that made me take a
written course (with teacher guidance) for pets to get the basic
1 and 2, and prescribe now in acute for my own pets like you do,
and had more success with it then the 4 time antibiotic the regular
vets put my pet true with still no cure in sight. Its not ideal
but still better then follow allopathic way.

A pity there are no more classical prescribers around here.

When i read your cats tail story i found that you did very well, i too
would have chosen hypericum and ledum.
Very reassuring it was/is when Dr Jill on list thought that both were
ok. How is the cat doing? and what was the couse of the bite on tail?

Greeting
Marleen
Monday, February 10, 2003, 10:29:21 AM, becklesfield wrote:
Marleen

[becklesfield]

Hi Marleen

Yes, it is very reassuring to have Dr Jill on the list. I know there
are a couple of other wonderful homeopathic vets on this list too,
they must be busy at the moment.

I agree, it is very sad that there are not more classical homepathic
vets around. I too am doing a 3-4 month introduction to homeopathy
to learn the basics in first aid and acute prescribing. I still find
it scary to do though (I'm right at the beginning of my course),
which I feel is a good thing as respect for this system of medicine
is essential and I've seen first hand what it can do when used
incorrectly.

Thank you for asking about my cat. His tail is healing nicely and he
has full movement back - I'm so pleased.

I allow my cats to have outdoor access and being a male, he gets into
scrapes from time to time. We also have a fairly mean ex-tom cat
living locally that occasionally feels the need to make like he's
still got his testicles and this is a trademark bite of his; the fact
that it's on Pliskin's tail shows that he was running away, he's
pretty respectful of the ex-tom. Normally my cat is the cavalier
alpha male of the area. This is the first time in a year that we've
had a problem though, which is good. Though it made me realise I
really need to buy that home-kit!

Becky

--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, Marleen wrote:
UK
asked a
in a
dog
did a
and
vet,
do,
regular
too
were
tail?

[Dave Hartley]

Another viewpoint, from another person who I also know & respect from
homeopathy email list
=========FORWARDED MESSAGE=============
You wrote about Richard Pitcairn on the lyghtforce list yesterday:

While I do have the bias of having studied with Richard, and, as such
may be lumped into the catagory of RP groupie, I cannot agree with this
person's assessment of Richard's work.

He's one of the brightest and most critical homeopaths I know, perhaps
critical to a fault. I would certainly not call him a pseudo-homeopath.

I cannot comment about his students. That's the danger of teaching, eh
?? Some folks get it, some don't. Some get part of it,.... And every
where the student falls, whatever their capabilities, they are taken as
a representation of the teacher.

I do know that Richard is continually striving to make homeopathy
understandable to the folks who take his course. If you follow his
course material and his written, you can see that - he modifies, tries
things, discards them if they do not work,..... He always returns to the
roots and art and science of homeopathy.

A few years ago, lamentably, and perhaps helping fuel the above comment,
he experimented with a "flow chart" like system to work through cases.
His use of that did not persist,....
Richard's course provide good solid information in homeopathic theory
and practice. He emphasizes the larger remedies, the anti-miasmatic
medicines, in his teaching, because, as he says, they will solve the
largest number of your cases. He is not too supportive (at all
supportive) of speculative homeopathy or of eclectic mongrel bastards.
He has been thoughtful and analytical in any of his conversations and
writings to which I have been privy.

In his teaching he also talks about how to simplify the approach to the
case, how to use one's clinical time wisely, and how to get to the meat
of the situation. He's recently been using the Baron's case analysis
methods, as are many of us, for those cases that seem (or are) flat, or
for which we may be in a situation in which one has to make a
prescription for a case in which we do not have all the information
(adoptee,.... new owner,... whatever,...).

As I said, he's not very apologetic, and if you step up to the plate
with him, you'd best be able to substantiate your claims. Critical to a
fault ?

I'd highly recommend his course material and his other writings to
anyone who would like to become educated in homeopathy. (Unfortunately,
he's yet to publish a book on homeopathy {Natural Health for Dogs and
Cats is not really that !}, though I know he's taking a sabbatical this
year to do that, among other projects.)

I certainly don't want to get into an endless debate about who is who
and how they practice and how they are perceived as practicing and how
well , if at all, any of their students represent their teachings, but I
found your assessment off the mark of my experience with Richard. And
while Richard can most certainly defend himself if he so chose, I
thought I'd share my take on the time we have spent together and my
experiences with his homeopathic philosophy, both in and out of the
classroom.
==================== END =======================
Dave Hartley
www.localcomputermart.com/dave
Santa Cruz, CA (831)464-8127

[gmccool2]

Hi Dave,

I'd have to second (the second) unsolicited post regarding Richard
Pitcairn, completely. I have some of his tapes and his dedication
to/knowledge of classical homeopathy is very obvious. He is a
marvelous case taker and an excellent teacher. He continually
stresses further reading, research and learning beyond his classes.
His path to homeopathy was an amazing story but I'll bet he made many
sacrifices, financially, for a long time, at the beginning of his
career.

It might be a hindrance that those who take his courses are already
firmly entrenched in (allopathic) practice. They want to learn a
more effective way to treat their patients but I imagine it is very
difficult to take time out of a heavy existing schedule to do it as
thoroughly as one might wish or with the same intensity a lay person
might be able to extend.

Unfortunately, non veterinarians are excluded from attending his
courses. In the world of (human) homeopathy, a non medically trained
person can submerge themselves in years of training in a school of
homeopathy or naturopathy as a career goal in itself and be eligible
to practice at completion. Not so in vet homeopathy (in the US). No
matter how many degrees or how many homeopathic/naturopathic schools
you might attend, you can not practice homeopathy on animals. Only
licensed vets may do so. Non vets can not subscribe to the Academy
of Veterinary Homeopathy journal.

Also, unfortunately, I've experienced the vet homeopath visits (4
different vets to whom I was able to travel to see) that consisted of
them having phone conversations chatting with relatives as I am being
charged by the minute, refusal to even look at (or even accept for
filing away) case histories of the animals that I painstakingly
prepared (making me feel foolish for even trying to submit the
information), casual glances *toward* the animal (if really lucky)
and rote prescriptions of polycrests, again if lucky. Two didn't
know the difference between herbs and homeopathy. Honestly. They
were all *trained* by Pitcarin but have nothing else in common with
him than that. Having listened to small portions of his courses (for
which I feel privileged), I know they don't represent his abilities.
Surely there are good ones out there, I just can't get there from
here.

I would like to see naturopathic/homeopathic colleges for
certification in treating non human animals, as they have for human
animals, that don't require a medical degree to attend. At least,
I'd like to be able to subscribe to the AVH journal.

Best,
Georgianna
--- In minutus@yahoogroups.com, "Dave Hartley" wrote:
from
someone
end
you!"
such
this
perhaps
homeopath.
eh
taken as
tries
to the
comment,
cases.
aware
theory
bastards.
and
the
meat
flat, or
to a
(Unfortunately,
and
this
who
how
but I
And
end up
aware