list etiquette and focus maintenance

[andyh]

Dear List,
Here is one other idea for procedure. Perhaps posts that are offtopic
could be identified via the title
in a way such as:

OFFTOPIC-"subject, concisely described".

This way people know what the off-topic post is from the title, and can
avoid opening the post it in the first place if not interested. As
well, it keeps the idea alive of what is off-topic and what is not, in a
"self-policing" way which is also a contagious example to new members.

Anybody else like this idea or suggest something better?

Best to all,
Andy

[Dave Hartley]

In years past, when listees were all pretty much cognizant of 'netiquette,
and generally wouldn't THINK of posting off-topic (except very. very rarely)
this device was used.
Persons posting off-topic regularly, were regularly "flamed" into "toast"
and often "shunned" &/or "banned."
This is speaking of internet email lists in general, not this one in
particular.
Here & now, for some reason, it takes an act of congress to get the topical
focus widely recognized, even though it has always been perfectly clearly
stated.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/minutus/
"The aim of MINUTUS discussion group is to share useful information on
classical and Hahnemannian homoeopathy."

short & sweet.

There is probably NO ONE here, who DOES NOT have some sort of off-topic
stuff s/he could inundate the list with.. happily, most exercise
self-control.

Likely, some participants with strong interests in other areas are
subscribed to lists appropriate to those interests .. long ago there was a
famed "list of lists" .. now obsolete due to sheer numbers... and to the
ease by which a search engine can be used to locate lists on virtually any
topic imagineable.
Dave Hartley
www.Mr-Notebook.com
www.localcomputermart.com/dave
Seattle, WA 425.820.7443
Asheville, NC 828.285.0240

[Shannon Nelson]

Flaming and "toasting" have been specifically banned on this list.

In fact, the direction to "be kind to each other" is much more clearly
stated than "toe the goddamned line or die."

If you think someone, or some topic, needs to be banned, take it to Ardavan
or his appointee. You are *not* his appointee.

Shannon
on 11/5/02 10:31 PM, Dave Hartley at dave@localcomputermart.com wrote:

[Shannon Nelson]

Hi Andy,

I like this idea. It also keeps alive the idea that "different" doesn't
need to mean "dead"!

And it's worth repeating that, for a subject like homeopathy, which is so
concerned with "the whole person", and which concerns people who are likely
to have done much else, very little is *really* "off-topic", tho we are
asked to maintain a "topical focus"...

If an exchange is *truly* off-topic, e.g. someone wants to have a detailed
discussion about how to use this herb for that trouble, etc., perhaps the
first "mention" could be followed by an invitation to continue off-list,
with those that wish to?

Shannon
on 11/5/02 6:43 PM, andyh@mcn.org at andyh@mcn.org wrote:

[Dave Hartley]

Thank you for your input, very important, I am sure.

The purpose & meaning of the post seems to have been entirely lost on you,
however.

no matter,

ps- you seem to be slipping back into the habit of failing to remove one or
two full posts of extraneous text including list-appended notices. Most
listees will be grateful if you (& others) would observe this additional
time-honored facet of 'netiquette.... others being "post on topic" ..
"don't post 'me too' and 'thank you' one-liners" (especially when followed
by a the full previous posting) .. all considered *common courtesy* on the
internet, at least until recently, when it seems that up to 80% of people
are clueless newbies, unaware that a tradition of 'netiquette even exists

Dave Hartley
www.Mr-Notebook.com
www.localcomputermart.com/dave
Seattle, WA 425.820.7443
Asheville, NC 828.285.0240

[andyh]

Robert&Shannon Nelson wrote:
Dear Shannon,
thanks for your reply. I think it would work to keep things focussed and maybe keep the prompting to a minimum.
However, it is a "rule", and might degenerate over time unless there is some supervision (but not with bulldog tactics). Nobody likes rules, but this convention would be pretty minimal: only if someone knows it is offtopic, they just include "OFFTOPIC" as the first word in the title. Anybody else have an opinion?

not attached to result of this suggestion but aware that cooperation and harmony beats competition and dictatory, and is a higher quality standard of life; (note that I dont mean this as criticism of anyone, this is just general viewpoint). the quicker we come to long-term solution the better.

Best
Andy

[Dave Hartley]

Hello S.V.,

Regardless of who believes that homeopathy is or is not the only answer to
every person's health-challenges, it remains the topic of this list.

Reckeweg, Bach-flower, TCM, and so on are clearly and definitively outside
of the topic

I have never yet met or read of a person who had great success with
practicing classical homeopathy who then went on to suggest that mixtures of
15 remedies is actually more suitable in any instance.

Most of us here are probably not complete masters of classical homeopathy,
presumably we are joined here to progress along that path, having been
attracted to join due to the topical focus.

Conversations which are off-topic have the entire rest of the world and
cyberspace in which to take place.

As I have previously mentioned, at least ten polite & reason-oriented posts
were directed to the perpetrator of the current list-clogging debacle;
when these availed not, some few short and sarcastic sorties were attempted,
when these availed not, a couple of blunt observations were made, followed
by name-calling hysterics from the perpetrator, at which point many members
appealed to the list moderator, who points out that the list is and has been
from it's inception "classical homeopathy."

Persons who refuse to respect topical focus should be banned after a few
warnings.
This works well, where reasoning & request fails, and common decency with
respect to topic exists not & thus is immune to appeal.

This list has been quite blissfully free of dedicated hecklers in the past,
so this option has never had to be exercised.
It will be interesting to see if our relentless perpetrator has come only to
attempt to turn conversation off topic or if there is genuine interest ON
topic.

Recent posting advocates for the former.
Dave Hartley
www.Mr-Notebook.com
www.localcomputermart.com/dave
Seattle, WA 425.820.7443
Asheville, NC 828.285.0240

[Shannon Nelson]

Hi Andy and all,

(Sorry this is tardy!)
Just a quick suggested amendment -- on Lyghtforce, instead of "OFFTOPIC",
one just notes, e.g., "OT-Which Brand of Socks?", etc. I realize that could
be ambiguous at first, but one catches on, and it clutters up the e-mail
index less, makes it easier (at least on my set-up) to read the rest of the
title. Just my thought...

But I'd think that either should do nicely!
And yeah, vive la cooperacion!!!

Best,
Shannon
on 11/6/02 5:43 PM, andyh@mcn.org at andyh@mcn.org wrote:

only if someone knows it is offtopic,